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| azazel | hi all, i'm approaching now zope3 technologies as i'm porting some old code to plone2.5 and zope 2.9.5, i've already used some bits of them like views and adaptors, but now i'm facing with a more extensive adaptors usage snd i have some questions thart i hope you guys can /will answer | 17:41 |
| philiKON | azazel, just ask your questinos | 17:42 |
| philiKON | don't ask questions about questions :) | 17:42 |
| azazel | yes:)... was just an intro:) | 17:43 |
| philiKON | no intros necessary :) | 17:43 |
| azazel | ok so i have some fragments of a plone ui which are calculated in different way than the standard plone , For exemple i have declare a IPortletCalculator which works in pair with a DefaultPortletCalulator that adapts (*, IMySite) to IPortletCalculator and supplies portlets data for the generic plone content. The main view MySite asks for an adaptor and get it | 17:49 |
| philiKON | azazel, you write too long lines | 17:51 |
| philiKON | please split them up | 17:52 |
| philiKON | and perhaps ask specific questions | 17:52 |
| azazel | Now i need to declare a more "specific" adaptor for just one interface so my question is if i declare that adaptor to be more specific like for="IMyspecificInterface \n IMySite, what will be the behavior of zope, when IMySite ask for an adaptor for a content object which implements IMySpecificInterface? | 17:54 |
| azazel | will i get both adaptor classes? or just the more specific one? | 17:55 |
| benji | you get the most specific adapter | 17:56 |
| azazel | mmm, so it does the right thing! nice to know! | 17:58 |
| azazel | :) thanks benji | 17:59 |
| azazel | both the next question is: what happens when two adaptors are equally specific | 18:01 |
| azazel | but it's enough for now:) | 18:02 |
| benji | the most recently registered one wins | 18:02 |
| * rocky schemes on how to ensure his adapters are always the most recently registered ones... and decides to prefix all of this package names with zzzzz just to be sure .... :) | 18:03 | |
| azazel | eheheh:) | 18:03 |
| benji | actually, if you use ZCML, you'll get a conflict, but that's a ZCML thing not a component registry thing | 18:04 |
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| ChrisW | philiKON: ping? | 18:04 |
| philiKON | pong | 18:04 |
| azazel | or i can use override.zcml to rule things a bit? | 18:04 |
| benji | azazel: yep | 18:06 |
| azazel | good, many thanks | 18:07 |
| * azazel set up emacs to open .zcml with nxml-mode:) | 18:08 | |
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| philiKON | J1m, ayt? | 18:38 |
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| J1m | yes | 18:39 |
| philiKON | so i brainstormed on "sites" a bit | 18:39 |
| philiKON | nowadays we usually call a site manager a component registry | 18:39 |
| philiKON | coz that's what it does, it registeres (and looks up) components | 18:39 |
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| philiKON | so a site is just a place where we can have such a component registry | 18:39 |
| ChrisW | *sigh* how come trailing dots are no longer supported in zcml dotted paths? | 18:40 |
| philiKON | ChrisW, use + | 18:40 |
| philiKON | people usually associate something else with the term "site", though | 18:40 |
| philiKON | they think "website" | 18:40 |
| philiKON | e.g. like "CMF Site" | 18:40 |
| philiKON | "Plone SIte" etc. | 18:40 |
| philiKON | so, i think we need a better name for sites | 18:40 |
| ChrisW | I thought that was the zope 3 idea of a site too? | 18:40 |
| philiKON | no | 18:40 |
| philiKON | z3's idea of sites is just a place where you can make local component registrations | 18:41 |
| ChrisW | hmm, well, it used to be ;-) | 18:41 |
| philiKON | they are, as i called it in seattle during a dinner conversations, the quantum leaps of acquisition in z3 :) | 18:41 |
| ChrisW | :-( | 18:41 |
| ChrisW | ;-) | 18:41 |
| J1m | z3's notion is pretty close to CMF Site. | 18:41 |
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| J1m | which is probably why I used that terminology. | 18:41 |
| philiKON | yes | 18:41 |
| philiKON | well | 18:41 |
| philiKON | this might sound crazy | 18:42 |
| philiKON | but at the seattle sprint | 18:42 |
| philiKON | godefroid came to me with a propblem | 18:42 |
| ChrisW | J1m: yup, except you can't successfully nest CMF Sites, although I've known people to try ;-) | 18:42 |
| philiKON | they wanted a *view* to be notified of arbitrary events that occurred during the view's execution time | 18:42 |
| J1m | ChrisW, I've seen it done. | 18:42 |
| philiKON | the use case was ajax | 18:43 |
| philiKON | their ajax framework uses z3 events | 18:43 |
| ChrisW | class=".SomePyFile+" don't work :-( | 18:43 |
| ChrisW | should it? | 18:43 |
| philiKON | no idea. just spell it out :/ | 18:43 |
| philiKON | anyways, their ajax framework works with standard object events | 18:43 |
| ChrisW | it works if I do class=".SomePyFile.SomePyFile" | 18:43 |
| J1m | ChrisW, I don't remember what the trailing + was supposed to do. | 18:43 |
| J1m | so use that | 18:44 |
| philiKON | so when an object changes, e.g. the title, all the appropriate bits and pieces in the UI are refreshed | 18:44 |
| philiKON | it's a very neat idea | 18:44 |
| philiKON | so, what we came up with is to have local component registrations on the view | 18:44 |
| ChrisW | well, the trailing . used to be so you didn't have to type lots of ".MyClass.MyClass" | 18:44 |
| philiKON | so the view is a site | 18:44 |
| ChrisW | anyone know why it's now verboten? | 18:44 |
| philiKON | that obviously confused some people | 18:44 |
| philiKON | ChrisW, well, you shouldn't be creating CamelCase modules in the first place | 18:44 |
| philiKON | ChrisW, and i have no idea why it's not workign anymore | 18:45 |
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| philiKON | i think we converted it into a trailing + at some point | 18:45 |
| ChrisW | it's been explicitly removed, since the trailing . raises an error | 18:45 |
| philiKON | but perhaps we dind't | 18:45 |
| ChrisW | but it looks like the trailing + doesn't look like it's there | 18:45 |
| ChrisW | oh well, ne'ermind | 18:45 |
| philiKON | anyways, while perhaps crazy or not, views can very well be ISites and it made perfect sense for their use case | 18:46 |
| J1m | philiKON, thinking about a view being s site is too much work. :) | 18:46 |
| philiKON | it was very little work, in fact :) | 18:46 |
| J1m | For their use case, they needed to somehow have a registry of subscribers on a view (or a view class). | 18:47 |
| J1m | I suspect that there is a lighter way to do it. | 18:47 |
| philiKON | right | 18:47 |
| philiKON | perhaps | 18:47 |
| philiKON | my point is just that zope 2 allowed you to acquire things from anywhere | 18:47 |
| J1m | I also suspect that are lots of particulars in this story that I don't have time to know. :) | 18:48 |
| philiKON | in z3 you have to make things a site in order to be able to acquire from it | 18:48 |
| J1m | anyway, pretending that this is a reasonable thing to do .... | 18:48 |
| philiKON | sites don't always have to be folders | 18:48 |
| J1m | where do you think this leads? | 18:48 |
| philiKON | a new understanding/terminology for sites | 18:48 |
| J1m | no, you can acquire from anything above you in the containment hoerarchy | 18:48 |
| philiKON | well, i meant like "component architecture" acquisition | 18:49 |
| J1m | I'm not terribly fond of the word site. | 18:49 |
| philiKON | right | 18:49 |
| J1m | Right, you can'rt acquire components from something that isn't a component registry. | 18:49 |
| philiKON | me neither | 18:49 |
| philiKON | exactly | 18:49 |
| philiKON | or, to be exact: | 18:49 |
| philiKON | you can't acquire components form something that doesn't *have* a component registry | 18:49 |
| philiKON | currently we call sucha thing a site | 18:49 |
| philiKON | but potentially anything could have a component registry | 18:50 |
| J1m | although, given feedback recently, I'm not fond of changing things unless there is a *really* compelling reason to. :) | 18:50 |
| philiKON | not just things people generally understand as "sites" | 18:50 |
| philiKON | yes | 18:50 |
| philiKON | i realize that also | 18:50 |
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| philiKON | i feel the same way | 18:50 |
| philiKON | anyways, i really have nowhere to go with this yet | 18:51 |
| philiKON | just wanted to run my thoughts by you | 18:51 |
| philiKON | the views-need-specific-subscribers thing isn't a terribly good example, i admit | 18:51 |
| philiKON | but i can see the use in more things having their own registries | 18:52 |
| J1m | keep in mind that registries are not lightweight. | 18:52 |
| J1m | They can consume a fair bit of memory due to their caches. | 18:53 |
| philiKON | hmm | 18:53 |
| philiKON | that's a good point | 18:53 |
| J1m | It might be possible in the future to allow registries to us eless memory by being a little more selective about what they will cache. | 18:54 |
| J1m | But that will take some engineering. | 18:54 |
| J1m | And my list of engineering projects is long and my time to work on them is short. | 18:54 |
| philiKON | hehe, sure | 18:54 |
| philiKON | well, i'm not saying we should encourage registry proliferation | 18:54 |
| philiKON | but in grok, for example, we thought of a simple way to say: "make this view available there" where "there" is some object | 18:55 |
| J1m | I'm not saying it wouldn't be nice if we could. :) | 18:55 |
| philiKON | it just seems that the word "site" is misleading in many ways | 18:55 |
| philiKON | because that "there" doesn't really need to have the notion of a site that we typically do | 18:56 |
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| philiKON | anyways, we're agreeing mostly | 18:56 |
| J1m | yup | 18:56 |
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| guruz | hello | 20:04 |
| guruz | how can i get line numbers etc when the TAL parser can't evaluate something and throws for example a KeyError? | 20:04 |
| philiKON | the traceback should contain that info | 20:05 |
| guruz | it does not | 20:06 |
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| timte | If I want prev and next available as browser pages, do I need on browser:page for each page or can I specify an interface and all its methods will be browser pages? | 21:32 |
| timte | s/on/a/ | 21:32 |
| philiKON | you need individual browser:page decl | 21:35 |
| philiKON | thoough you can save some typing with browser:pages | 21:35 |
| timte | <browser:pages interface="..." /> would be nice, or are there drawbacks? | 21:36 |
| philiKON | how would you specify edit.html? | 21:38 |
| philiKON | or similar views | 21:38 |
| philiKON | i don't really see the advantage | 21:38 |
| philiKON | you'd have to type the interface | 21:38 |
| timte | less typing | 21:38 |
| philiKON | so you can just aas well type the zcml | 21:38 |
| timte | I have an interface anyways | 21:39 |
| philiKON | aha | 21:39 |
| philiKON | weird | 21:39 |
| philiKON | either way, interfaces typically document python apis | 21:39 |
| philiKON | not everything in a browser view API has to be meant to be publishable | 21:39 |
| timte | Let's say you have a IMusicPlayer with stop, record, rewind, fast forward and all that stuff. I go to some.url.com/music/stop for stopping the music or have some ajax stuff that uses that url. That's many browser pages. I thought there might be a shortcut. | 21:42 |
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| timte | or is it like in zope 2 that an object's method can be triggered by the url without any browser pages? | 21:46 |
| philiKON | not really | 21:46 |
| philiKON | you probably want a <browser:view> with subpages | 21:47 |
| philiKON | other than that i'm afraid you'll have to type :( | 21:47 |
| philiKON | anyways, bbl | 21:47 |
| timte | :) | 21:47 |
| radix | So I think I need to implement something like a HiddenSequence formlib widget. Has anyone done anything like that yet? | 21:47 |
| timte | ok, thanks | 21:47 |
| philiKON | radix, hidden? | 21:48 |
| philiKON | radix, as in: widget.hidden() ? | 21:48 |
| radix | philiKON: I need to put in a bunch of <input type="hidden" name="constant" value="variable" /> into some forms | 21:48 |
| philiKON | yes, i believe existing widgets can already to that | 21:48 |
| philiKON | they have a hidden method | 21:48 |
| philiKON | incl. the sequence widget | 21:48 |
| philiKON | gotta go, though | 21:49 |
| radix | hmm ok, I'll take a look. thanks. | 21:49 |
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