IRC log of #zope for Thursday, 2011-07-07

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neutrinohi, Is there any issue running zope in 64bit ubuntu?09:06
neutrinoI am having an issue with zope module when i try to create a new site in plone 4.0.7
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davisaglineutrino: do you get any more info in the log on disk? (var/log/instance.log, probably)09:25
neutrinodavisagli, just a moment, i will create another gist for the log09:27
davisaglineutrino: looks like it's having trouble determining your computer's timezone. you could try setting the TZ environment variable09:31
neutrinodavisagli, where should i set that?09:32
davisaglineutrino: this looks like the same issue:
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neutrinodavisagli: seems  like the problem is similar and I am too from Kathmandu, Nepal09:35
neutrinodavisagli, thank a lot.09:42
davisaglineutrino: good luck!09:42
neutrinoAs you suggested, it was issue with the time zone09:42
neutrinodavisagli, it there any way that i can fix this issue so  that other developers doesn't have to bang theri head :)09:51
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gypsymaurohi, I've a 2.9.6 yes I know it's an old version but I can't upgrade right now :( is from 2 days that after a while it hangs and I dunno why, I can't enter in the ZMI but I can telnet on the port , how can I recognize what's wrong?10:33
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MacYETnew alive13:46
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bigkevmcdshame there's a broken image on the front page13:54
planetzopebotReturn a list of internationalized names of languages in Plone 4 (active questions tagged zope - Stack Overflow)
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HackbardI want to search in my hole zope for objects of an type how can i make that?15:10
Hackbardi have to say it is zope 2.1015:11
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koshbigkevmcd: what image do you see as broken? when I look at it the images all seem there and nothing strange shows up in network inspect on chrome16:46
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koshbigkevmcd: my problem is that every resource gets a GET request on every access since they can't be cached without revalidataion16:46
koshso the page loads in 2.3 seconds instead of .8 seconds from what I am looking at16:47
koshand I bet that .8 seconds would be even lower without the load from all those get requests that get 304 each time16:47
koshit is something I tried to bring up as a change but technical suggestions where not wanted16:48
koshit is something that annoys me about web frameworks, they still won't do stuff the right way16:48
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koshsomething is generating urls with a cache key so the url does look like it is unique to the resource16:49
koshbut the caching headers don't allow it to actually be cached without a roundtrip to the server for each validation16:50
koshand it looks like a roundtrip to the server to check adds .3 seconds to the time with some in parallel16:50
koshif they would be set to cache without needing to revalidate it would lower server load and also increase page speed for visitors16:50
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RichardBarrellkosh: we have used Varnish to solve that kind of issue before.17:23
RichardBarrellYou can write a somewhat-frightening VCL file that munges headers according to regexes applied against incoming HTTP headers in order to replace the caching information that Zope is serving with information that is correct for your specific application.17:25
RichardBarrellIt's pretty hairy but Varnish deals with it just fine and at high throughput. And as a bonus, you get to use Varnish's caching infrastructure along the way, which is hot-diggity-damn fast.17:26
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koshRichardBarrell: heh varnish, yesterday two major sites I use both where dead many times with varnish errors17:28
koshhowever the point is that if you generate a unique url for a resource then the browser should NEVER check back17:28
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koshexpires and cache-control headers should be set to some ridiculous number like 30 years or so17:29
RichardBarrellYeah, Varnish is quite visible when it falls over.17:29
koshthe browser should not be checking back and getting a 304 over and over again17:29
RichardBarrellBut from out experience when Varnish "falls over" and starts serving error messages it's invariably the backend servers behind it that have gone down.17:29
koshsince it does not matter how fast the server responds you are still slowing the entire system down by requiring a lot of additional connects17:29
RichardBarrellYyyyyes. You can use VCL to rewrite the response headers so that Varnish will add the 30-year expiry and cache-control headers for you. That's what I was suggesting. :)17:30
koshI had some pages that where made up of about 80 requests which is fairly low now and on a low latency link it was about 3 seconds to grab the page, by setting unique and permanent caching for all urls other then the actual html page the time went to .5 seconds17:31
koshah I see what you mean17:31
RichardBarrellI think that what you actually see on the 'net is not a large number of flaky failure-prone Varnish servers, but a large number of sites with flaky failure-prone backends that are being propped up by putting Varnish in front of them.17:31
koshI actually solved that problem in zope since it only took me about an hour or so17:31
RichardBarrellYeah, sorry I didn't explain it clearly enough.17:32
koshI just don't get why frameworks don't do that by default now17:32
koshit makes such a huge difference and lowers load by such an extreme ammount17:32
koshand plone is obviously generating unique keys for most of that stuff17:33
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koshhaving a unique key but requiring revalidation just seem insane17:33
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RichardBarrellYes it is. I presume that Plone's devs would welcome patches.17:46
koshI doubt it17:47
koshI have brought up some of the ideas before and had no interest on it17:48
koshlast time I tried to do anything with the plone community I found it was pretty hostile towards changes17:48
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sm__g'day all18:12
sm__I have made the zope3 wiki's skin consistent with the others, leaving that pond design for sole use of the foundation site18:13
sm__and updated the intro blurb at - corrections welcome18:13
sm__if you see the old stylesheet you'll need to shift reload18:18
koshgive the new stylesheet a new url so that you don't need to do that :)18:19
koshwork with the browsers not against them18:19
koshif the css changes it should have a new url and that url should be permanently cacheable18:19
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sm__kosh: sorry, zwiki's skin isn't that smart. I'm hoping something will expire soon18:38
sm__or jens will hear of this and flush the right cache18:39
sm__I suppose I'd better mention it on list18:40
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*** menesis has joined #zope22:05 relaunched (Site - Blog of Andreas Jung) relaunched (gmane.comp.web.zope.announce)
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