IRC log of #zope3-dev for Wednesday, 2009-07-29

« Tuesday, 2009-07-28 Index Thursday, 2009-07-30 »
pcarduneTheuni1: this thread from ZODB-Dev looks like the problem: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zodb-dev/2002-February/002250.html00:00
Theuni1yeah, rings a bell00:00
Theuni1not too loudly though ;)00:01
pcarduneI'm a bit fuzzy on how OOBTrees work in general00:01
Theuni1IIRC you need to watch out for the same issues with using objects as btree keys as you would for dicts00:02
benjiTheuni1: you do recall correctly00:07
Theuni1benji: was it identical or are the some deviations I don't remember?00:08
benjiidentical, as far as I know00:08
benjiyou have to make sure the keys have a hash that doesn't change00:08
pcardunewhat are the issues with using objects as dictionary keys?00:08
benjithe hash can't change ;)00:09
benjiwith dictionaries it usually works because object hashs default to the ID, which is derrived from the memory address00:09
benjisince that can't change during a program run, you don't have a problem00:09
pcarduneright00:09
pcardunepersistent objects are where the trouble comes00:10
benjiright00:10
Theuni1also, the hashes must be unique00:10
Theuni1the code you referenced has pretty strong collision chances00:10
Theuni1the one from thomas00:10
benjiit's easier to create a key that identifies each object and use that instead (like an int ID)00:10
benji(easier than trying to get the hashing to work just right)00:11
pcardunebut OOBTrees don't do that00:11
Theuni1the OID would work for simple cases I guess00:11
benjiyep00:11
pcardunewell, this problem recently came up when we switched from using mapping storage to filestorage00:11
pcarduneand that would explain why it's a bit hard to test...00:11
pcarduneany tips on the best way to test something like this?00:12
Theuni1either stochastically (which makes it slow) or some tedious work to force the collision00:13
Theuni1i wonder why btrees should behave different in mappingstorage/filestorage00:14
pcarduneTheuni1: glad to hear that I'm not the only one wondering that :)00:15
Theuni1does mappingstorage do the whole mvcc dance with old revisions and transaction history?00:15
Theuni1I'm a bit tired currently and need to go to bed soon ...00:15
benjithey probably don't, but mappingstorages are in-memory, right?  if so, the object's hash can't change during a run, so no problem; when using a filestorage to persist OOBTrees between runs, you'll start having problems00:16
pcardunebenji: but don't the objects kind of get "persisted" by being pickled and then unpickled?00:16
Theuni1benji: the storage API should abstract that away so the objects would actually change00:17
benjiI don't think mapping storage pickles anything00:17
Theuni1it has to00:17
pcardunejust that it gets pickled to and from memory rather than disk00:17
* benji goes to look at the source00:17
Theuni1it's not the task of the storage to do that00:17
Theuni1the storage never sees anything else00:17
Theuni1I fiddled with that API a lot and I'm pretty sure about most of it by now ;)00:17
benjiyep, it deals only in pickles; therefore I have no idea why pcardune is seeing differences00:19
benjihmm, if the object cache is large enough, no objects will ever be loaded from the storage, I wonder if that has something to do with it (but the object cache size should be the same regardless of the underlying storage)00:22
Theuni1yup00:22
Theuni1also: when connections change due to threading, this wouldn't hold anymore.00:22
Theuni1i've gotta go to bed now :)00:23
* Theuni1 waves00:23
benjipcardune: if you can make a short script that demonstrates the problem, I'd be interested in taking a look00:23
benjig'night Theuni100:23
Theuni1if you take it to the zodb list i'd be happy to have a look too00:23
pcardunebenji: i'll try... was very very hard for us to reproduce it00:23
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goschtlhi i search for an example of a z3c.form widget for zope.schema.Dict Fields. any pointers?12:30
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goschtlHi what is the recommended way of changing the size for a z3c.Form Text Widget?14:34
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goschtlprojekt01: sorry for stupid question but was is the best way to change size and maxlength with z3c.form?15:01
goschtlupdateWidgets?15:01
srichtergoschtl: CSS :-)15:12
goschtlsrichter: OK danke....15:13
srichtergoschtl: we specifically provide good CSS classes and ids in the rendered widget, so that CSS can be used for pretty much any use case15:15
goschtlsrichter: ok makes sense, thanks15:17
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