IRC log of #zope for Tuesday, 2010-08-10

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CIA-48chrism * r115601 /zope.i18nmessageid/branches/jython-compat: create branch06:55
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CIA-48chrism * r115602 /zope.i18nmessageid/branches/ (5 files in 3 dirs): (log message trimmed)08:06
CIA-483.5.3 (unreleased)08:06
CIA-48- Made compilation of C extension optional again; 3.5.1 broke this08:06
CIA-48inasmuch as this package become unusable on non-CPython platforms.08:06
CIA-48Making the compilation of the C extension optional again implied08:06
CIA-48removing ```` code added in 3.5.1 which made the C extension08:06
CIA-48chrism * r115603 zope.i18nmessageid/ (5 files in 3 dirs): Merge svn+ssh:// to trunk.08:06
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CIA-48chrism * r115604 zope.i18nmessageid/ (CHANGES.txt prep for 3.5.308:18
CIA-48chrism * r115605 /zope.i18nmessageid/tags/3.5.3: tag 3.5.308:18
CIA-48andreasjung * r115606 plonetheme.zope2/plonetheme/zope2/skins/plonetheme_zope2_custom_images/logo_calendar.gif: updated08:18
CIA-48chrism * r115607 zope.i18nmessageid/ (CHANGES.txt back to dev08:18
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planetzopebotzope.i18nmessageid 3.5.3 (PyPI recent updates)
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planetzopebotz3c.objectpolicy 0.1 (PyPI recent updates)
CIA-94icemac * r115614 z3c.pdftemplate/ (4 files in 2 dirs):10:06
CIA-94- Added missing install dependencies and test dependencies.10:06
CIA-94- Fixed tests to run with current package versions.10:06
CIA-94icemac * r115615 z3c.pdftemplate/ (src/z3c/pdftemplate/ CHANGES.txt): - Using python's `doctest` module instead of the deprecated `zope.testing.doctest`.10:06
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CIA-94chrisw * r115616 Zope/src/Zope2/Startup/ restore ability to set sockname from command line10:19
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kleisti've got a .db file which works fine with zodb 3.9.4, but with 3.9.5 i get POSKeyError
kleist... is this a known and common problem?10:29
kleist... and report no errors10:30
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planetzopebotPlomino 1.7.2 (PyPI recent updates)
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planetzopebotdm.zope.mockup 0.1 (PyPI recent updates)
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baijumJust posted a question to list: Any idea ?14:57
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_mup_Bug #615821 was filed: Turn package documentation into Sphinx style <zope.annotation:New> <>15:14
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CIA-94ctheune * r115617 /zopetoolkit/doc/source/zope-dev/ (zope-dev-20100810.rst index.rst): prepare today's meeting15:31
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CIA-94baijum * r115618 bluebream/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Added empty overrides.zcml - show best practices to developers17:01
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Charlie_XTheuni1: agenda URL isn't working17:57
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agroszerI guess the cronjob or whatever is dead17:58
Theuni1looks like the documentation wasn't updated17:58
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Theuni1well, i'm here :)18:00
Theuni1here's the raw data18:00
* Charlie_X is here18:01
Theuni1first topic as requested by Charlie_X is summit/dzug conference18:01
Theuni1you wanted to get an update. anything specific you're looking for?18:01
Theuni1there's with some information. and unfortunately Lennart won't be able to make it due to his work load.18:02
Charlie_XI think it's a bit low on publicity - no link from, no announce from there either.18:02
Theuni1Are you talking about the DZUG conference or the summit?18:02
Charlie_XConference, primarily. Looks like a good set of talks. Still looking for more.18:02
Theuni1talks are fixed18:03
Theuni1Charlie_X: do you have an influence on getting a link on
Charlie_XNever tried. Shouldn't be too hard. If I can't get it done MAL certainly can.18:04
Theuni1well, make it so ;)18:04
Theuni1i can write a message to the list18:04
* Charlie_X slaps head18:04
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Charlie_XCan you do an English announce to python-announce, europython? I can definitely get that on the pycon mailing list.18:05
Theuni1i also have the on my radar18:06
Charlie_XEverything is in German, n'est ce pasß18:07
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agroszeris it?18:07
Theuni1So for anyone who hasn't seen the list of talks yet, it's here:
Theuni1No, not everything.18:07
agroszerI guessed like Gary would speak english18:07
Theuni1There's Gary Poster, MatthewWilkes, Vincent Pelletier, Martijn Jacobs.18:07
agroszerwould help a bit to indicate there on the page18:08
Theuni1There will definitely be a lot of German in General. But a few are in English, too.18:08
agroszerTheuni1, are you prepared to record everything?18:08
Theuni1agroszer: it's basically all people who don't have German names.18:08
Theuni1agroszer: no, too much effort for us to get a reasonable result.18:08
agroszerTheuni1, ehhhh that's a bit implicit knowledge18:08
Theuni1we'll try to get all slides, though18:08
Theuni1agroszer: ;)18:08
agroszerwell, at least the slides18:09
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MatthewWilkesTheuni1: I could listen to philiKON, witsch and tomster and Germanicise my name to confuse things further? :)18:09
Theuni1MatthewWilkes: hell yeah18:09
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agroszerTheuni1, betr. videos, I could ask Ree how they did it for ploneconf.hu18:10
Theuni1Karlchen_X: anything else?18:10
Karlchen_XOn the conference, no. What's the status of the summit?18:10
Theuni1agroszer: we're not prepared for dealing with that, really. there's also the issue of release forms, etc.18:10
agroszerdzug takes over the channel18:10
agroszerTheuni1, okokok18:10
Karlchen_Xagroszer: Matt Hamilton has posted the plans for this year's Plone conference. Looks like the way to go IMNSHO.18:11
Theuni1Karlchen_X: i'm getting really close to preparing the actual topics etc. like tomorrow. i've been putting this off for a while, but looks like it will happen18:11
agroszerno plone, thanks18:11
* Karlchen_X has been "avoidling" for over a week now.18:11
Theuni1otherwise, everyone who comes needs to say whether they would also like to join the conference/sprints and everyone needs to make sure they have hotel room.18:11
agroszerI was at cause it was near18:11
Theuni1andrea should have mailed everyone who registered and ask for a room18:11
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Karlchen_Xagroszer: basically hire someone else to do the AV. Doesn't work out expensive and it happens.18:11
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Charlie_XTheuni1: no e-mail about a room here.18:12
Theuni1Charlie_X: ok, best would be you shoot a quick mail to, she'll get you one.18:13
Theuni1so, next topic18:14
Theuni1test runners18:14
Theuni1I have the feeling that we have way too much noise.18:14
agroszeror noone cares about fixing problems18:14
agroszerI did the winbot, but I can't fix all the win bugs18:15
mgedminit is a bit difficult to filter out useful information from the emails18:15
Theuni1mgedmin: that's my feeling as well18:15
Theuni1i was pondering to restructure the aggregation abit18:16
Theuni1i've seen some other aggregations that make a table instead of resorting everything18:16
agroszerwhat about a sort of table, like project x platform18:16
Theuni1agroszer: the aggregator doesn't have that information18:16
Theuni1but just having a stable sort every day would help18:16
* mgedmin wants a web page with pretty colours18:17
Theuni1currently its hard to read and keeps changing every day18:17
Theuni1mgedmin: i feel the same18:17
Theuni1i think the aggregator should write a status page and provide an overview + a single link to it18:17
Theuni1the current aggregator has so much noise due to the plain text format18:17
Theuni1I guess just getting a list of "These are the ones that failed:" that aggregates the subject and then have a single link to the full page would be helpful18:18
Theuni1Does anybody know where the code for the aggregator lives?18:18
Theuni1And who is running it again?18:18
* Theuni1 feels like automated messages should announce which human is responsible for them18:19
agroszerdoes that ring a bell?18:19
Theuni1so that's austria18:19
Charlie_XTheuni1: this will sound like procrastination but maybe a brainstorm at the summit? Stefan Schwarzer showed some interesting visualisation of test results at Europython. I certainly agree the current length of the e-mails invites /ignore.18:19
Theuni1yeah, i have a face in my head but i can't get the name18:19
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Theuni1Charlie_X: yeah, maybe18:19
agroszerPatrick Gerken (do3cc) ?18:19
Theuni1agroszer: nope, that's munich18:19
Charlie_XDidn't Stefan Holek set stuff up?18:19
Theuni1yeah, that's him18:20
Theuni1Charlie_X: yeah, maybe, it's not that far away, anyway18:20
Theuni1i'll take a note18:20
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agroszerit shouldn't be hard to make the aggregator know about the projects18:20
Theuni1increasing the amount of tests was a good idea, but i think the aggregator is hitting his capacity :)18:20
Theuni1agroszer: you coming to the summit?18:21
mgedminCharlie_X, are those slides with test visualizations online?18:21
* mgedmin missed EP this year18:21
Theuni1if yes, i'd postpone the issue18:21
agroszerTheuni1, nicht hetzen, ja?18:21
Theuni1hop hop!18:21
agroszerjust the paperwork...18:21
agroszeremm bitwork18:21
agroszergotta write that email18:22
Theuni1anyway, i would like to keep the aggregator general purpose18:22
Charlie_XSorry, it was Mark Fink who gave the talk:
Theuni1not knowing about the projects makes it easier to integrate things that aren't attached to packages/projects18:22
agroszeryay EP slides18:22
Charlie_XIn particular the qa analyzer on
agroszerTheuni1, can you get Stefan to document and publish that script?18:23
Charlie_XLooks like a good fit for the ZTK.18:23
agroszer(or whatever)18:23
Theuni1agroszer: i'll try to18:23
do3ccthat would be awesome18:23
do3ccright now the script is not even in a public repo18:23
Charlie_XMatthewWilkes: Is Stefan still working for Jarn?18:24
Theuni1i'll try to find stefan18:25
Theuni1agroszer: how's the documentation on the egg builder?18:26
Theuni1i noticed that i wanted to point there when mcdonc asked this morning18:26
Theuni1also, it seems to run daily18:26
Theuni1any chance to increase that frequency?18:26
agroszerseems to be online now18:26
Theuni1maybe 3 hours or so?18:26
Theuni1how expensive is a run if nothing needs to happen?18:26
agroszerTheuni1, sure, easy18:26
Theuni1if it is *really* cheap we could even make it check every 30 minutes or so18:27
agroszeraround 40 secs18:27
Theuni1lets make that 30 minutes18:27
agroszerlet's hope pypi does not kick our asses18:27
Theuni1agroszer: the docs look good18:28
agroszerfor DoS'ing them18:28
Theuni1if they do you can check gocept's mirror18:28
Theuni1i wnated to poke martin about the stability issues18:28
mcdoncthat thing is cool18:28
Theuni1I wonder whether you could add one thing to the docs18:28
Theuni1mcdonc: what?18:28
agroszerTheuni1, what?18:28
Theuni1agroszer: can you make a short paragraph in the beginning explaining the general operation, how people interact with the magic and how they see it worked or not?18:29
agroszerTheuni1, ok18:29
Theuni1like the 5 sentence abstract for those who need the results of the thing not to set up the thing itself18:29
Theuni1Meeting time is up. I'd like to announce two little things: i wrote the blueprint for consolidating the documentation and made a bug that references all the packages whose documentation we should work on.18:30
Theuni1agroszer: thanks18:30
Theuni1otherwise, you can have beer now.18:30
Charlie_XTheuni1: can you send me an e-mail with the desired changes to the bug tracker script?18:31
Charlie_XI've forgotten to nag you on numerous occasions.18:31
Theuni1Charlie_X: uh, can't even remember right now18:31
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Charlie_XI think it ties in to reducing the amount of mail noise.18:32
Charlie_XAnd pointing the finger.18:33
Theuni1that was about the repository checker18:33
Theuni1pointing out who has committed to which projects18:33
Theuni1so that you can ctrl-f for it18:33
mcdoncthe wineggbuilder is cool18:33
mcdoncsorry for not qualifying the coolness18:33
Charlie_Xhey mcdonc, don't think you can escape repoze.who questions just by changing channels! ;-)18:34
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* mcdonc lights Charlie_X on fire18:35
Charlie_XTheuni1: can you please put that in an e-mail for me?18:35
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* Charlie_X jumps in the bath18:36
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Theuni1alright, i'm outta here. need to pretend some real life18:37
Charlie_XSee ya.18:37
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koshso how are you freaks doing today?18:46
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smexcellent kosh, and yourself ?19:23
koshdoing fine here mostly19:24
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* sm remembers to look into mcdonc's beef with zopeplanetbot19:27
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smhmm.. what was it19:30
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mcdoncit'll come around on the guitar again19:32
mcdoncthe url to blog entries19:32
mcdoncas presented via the feed19:32
mcdonchad a PONG in it19:32
mcdoncsomeone injected a PONG19:32
mcdonci dont think it was us19:32
smPONG, thank you. I will get to the bottom of it19:33
mcdoncthanks sm19:33
* kosh hands sm a flamethrower to help19:35
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regebroiiiiiiii7,, lz19:50
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mgedminis that a cat typing?19:51
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regebro_elenorNope. It's Elenor.19:53
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davisagliregebro_elenor: :)19:55
davisagliregebro_elenor: gotta get them started young :)19:56
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regebroOk, whacking on the keyboard now lost it's interest. Back to normality. :)20:00
smthis is not mcdonc's issue, because that's hard, but there's something weird about
smitems keep disappearing off it.. they get announced here, but you won't see them at http://planetzope.org20:01
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d2msm, hi20:51
d2mre your request on items disappearing from planetzope: these are just the items announced on pypi20:52
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smhi d2m20:54
smhow come they disappear so quickly ?20:54
d2mthe feeds are updated every hour, pypi is a fast feed20:54
smideally, shouldn't planetzope's feed retain items according to its policy ?20:55
smie, last N items harvested from all feeds ?20:55
d2min the old planetzope version i had the pypi items in an extra box in the sidebar20:56
d2mand the items where persisted to the ZODB too20:57
d2mi do not persist feed items any longer20:57
d2mi do not use zope for any longer btw.20:58
koshplanetzope does not use zope20:58
smwhat do you use ? I like venus20:58
d2mmodern times ;)20:58
d2mi use python2.6, google feeds api and jquery20:59
koshah I have tried some other things and I just don't see anything that works as well as zope does21:00
smoh, clicky-expanding titles.. I see21:00
koshsecurity seems to be barely an afterthought21:00
d2mkosh: true21:00
kosheveryone I do has people that edit documents on the server etc kind of stuff21:00
koshI have started using jquery recently, it is okay just have to be careful with it if IE users need to view the site21:01
koshsince it is so easy to just kill an IE machine especially an older one with IE6 with it21:01
smI like a planet page you can rock up to and start reading high-signal content - like planet debian, planet gnome etc. Do the pypi package updates belong ? Though no-one has complained about them being announced here.21:02
koshactually people have complained about them being announced here21:02
d2mkosh: don't mix with checkin messages21:03
koshokay it was probably the checkin messages people complained about21:04
koshsometimes the channel gets spammed with them21:04
d2msm, should i move the pypi feed out of planetrzope ?21:04
smimho they're not interesting to general zope planet readers, and could be dropped from the main feed, yeah. Especially given their unusual disappearing act21:05
d2mok by me21:05
smany other votes ?21:05
smno hurry. I'll keep after this PONG bug21:06
d2mthere it goes...21:06
d2msm, btw - are you looking at or
smthe former21:07
smthe latter should be shut down, eh21:07
smseriously. It's bad21:07
smthat's the hostname yours should be at21:07
koshwhat is the PONG bug?21:07
smkosh: once in a while, planetzopebot seems to corrupt urls with "PONG"21:09
smwhen announcing items here21:09
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kleistkosh, IE6 deserves to be killed21:20
koshof course it does21:20
koshbut sometimes it has to be supported still21:20
koshlots of big companies that pay for stuff to be written still have an IE6 only policy21:20
kleistkosh, but then again the British Government wouldn't agree, neith their zillions of users21:20
kleistkosh, i know... that the sad facts of RL21:21
smmcdonc: I'm pretty sure it affects all of your blog's posts, and only those :)21:30
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smsomething triggering a bug in a library I'm using.. possibly the %20 urls21:30
mcdoncheh ok21:30
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mcdoncits the %20 to PONG library21:31
smwhich is good info. I'll come back to it asap, can't have the groundhog series getting mislinked21:31
mcdoncaw sure you can.. its only in irc21:31
* sm just clicked there, looks cool21:31
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smmcdonc: found it! fixed now, I hope22:18
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