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| RaceCondition | how do I find all classes that (in)directly implement an interface? smth like IFoo.getImplementors() | 03:01 |
|---|---|---|
| kosh | that sounds like it would be very difficult | 03:10 |
| kosh | since many of the classes that implement that interface may not even be loaded yet | 03:10 |
| kosh | what is your usage case for this? | 03:10 |
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| RaceCondition | kosh: I mean, get all the loaded classes that implement a given interface. purpose? just to get an overview of the architecture of a piece of software... introspection | 03:25 |
| RaceCondition | like, if I want to learn the structure of a piece of software to get familiar with it more quickly | 03:25 |
| RaceCondition | there's, of course, always the option to grep the source code for "implements(IGivenInterface)" | 03:26 |
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| mcdonc | RaceCondition: there is no foolproof way | 04:12 |
| mcdonc | (not even a fool-resistant way) | 04:12 |
| RaceCondition | so Interfaces don't really keep track of who implements them? | 04:13 |
| mcdonc | no.. at least, if they do, there's no docs about how to get that info back | 04:13 |
| davetoo | How could they? | 04:13 |
| mcdonc | well, implements() *could* keep around a global | 04:14 |
| mcdonc | it might even do that | 04:14 |
| mcdonc | but its not part of the API, afaik | 04:14 |
| RaceCondition | mcdonc: I guess I could just monkey patch it for introspection purposes | 04:14 |
| davetoo | I know so little about zope so far.. I have no idea how much FM I have no idea about, if you know what I mean :) | 04:14 |
| RaceCondition | are there any extensions points to ZCA itself to customise how it works and plug in new architectural pieces? | 04:15 |
| RaceCondition | unrelated to my previous question... it's just something that popped to my mind when I realized the universalness of ZCA | 04:16 |
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| mcdonc | RaceCondition: yes, although they arent really documented | 04:52 |
| mcdonc | you'll likely need to read the source | 04:52 |
| RaceCondition | mcdonc: nice, at least it's there | 04:52 |
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| tulga | good morning | 06:01 |
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| RaceCondition | how common in Zope it is to adapt classes instead of interfaces? I sometimes find it an overkill to always use an interface | 08:34 |
| RaceCondition | and also, how meaningful it is to always declare an interface, even if used by only one class? | 08:35 |
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| kosh | well so far I have not touched interfaces or adapters | 08:38 |
| kosh | no idea how common it is in other code | 08:38 |
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| RaceCondition | kosh: so what exactly do you use in zope if you haven't used interfaces nor adapters? | 08:55 |
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| kosh | I have been writing zope products and apps for probably 8 years or so | 09:07 |
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| mcdonc | RaceCondition: i adapt to classes instead of interfaces a good bit | 09:29 |
| RaceCondition | mcdonc: but why do most beginner sources give examples that obviously overuse interfaces? at least it seems to me like it | 09:30 |
| mcdonc | not sure really, maybe people dont know you can adapt to classes | 09:31 |
| RaceCondition | like, why the hell would I have an IBookmark interface for a Bookmark class to store bookmarks? | 09:31 |
| RaceCondition | hmm, I thought of that possibility, but even prominent sources do that | 09:31 |
| RaceCondition | so maybe I'm missing something very fundamental here | 09:32 |
| mcdonc | http://plope.com/Members/chrism/zca_thoughts_summary | 09:32 |
| mcdonc | i doubt you're missing anything fundamental | 09:33 |
| mcdonc | there really is a lot of heat and not much light surrounding this topic | 09:33 |
| RaceCondition | basically, would anybody ever swap out Bookmark and use BetterBookmark to implement IBookmark? | 09:33 |
| mcdonc | no idea, that's the sort of judgment you need to make when deciding whether to use an interface or a class | 09:34 |
| davisagli | RaceCondition: if you're writing code that's supposed to be reusable, it's probably worth it to define the interface. but if know you won't need it, there's no harm in just adapting the class | 09:34 |
| RaceCondition | davisagli: but why would I be reusing the IBookmark interface if it's just there to store a basic piece of data? | 09:35 |
| davisagli | maybe someone else has a different idea of what a bookmark is | 09:35 |
| mcdonc | i wouldnt bang your head on it much | 09:35 |
| davisagli | yeah | 09:36 |
| RaceCondition | there was something else that was very confusing as well, actually | 09:36 |
| RaceCondition | ah, well, I guess if I just ignore it for now... :P | 09:36 |
| mcdonc | most interfaces you see in the wild are grossly unncessary | 09:37 |
| mcdonc | i'll take that back | 09:38 |
| mcdonc | many *adaptations* you see in the wild are grossly unnecessayr | 09:38 |
| mcdonc | because someone has used an adaptation as a test dependency injection | 09:38 |
| mcdonc | and those adaptations look exactly like the ones that are for "real" plugpoints | 09:39 |
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| CIA-82 | naro * r118674 /z3c.sqlalchemy/branches/custom_relations: Such implementation is not needed. It is better to use declarative_base and specify keys in standard way | 10:05 |
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| tulga | guys, where can I get zope2 documentation? i mean download. | 11:03 |
| betabug | you could grab the repo for the zope book and build a pdf using the sphinx tools | 11:04 |
| betabug | probably/maybe there is a link to the repo on docs.zope.org | 11:05 |
| tulga | ok | 11:07 |
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| CIA-82 | tiazma * r118675 /Products.ExternalEditor/tags/1.1.0: Tagged Products.ExternalEditor 1.1.0 | 12:18 |
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| CIA-82 | tiazma 1.1.0 * r118676 Products.ExternalEditor/setup.py: oOps, I forgot to delete the 'dev' of the version number | 13:09 |
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| CIA-82 | tiazma 1.1.0 * r118676 Products.ExternalEditor/setup.py: oOps, I forgot to delete the 'dev' of the version number | 13:19 |
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| CIA-82 | jinty * r118677 z3c.form/ (4 files in 4 dirs): | 13:47 |
| CIA-82 | Add English translation (generated from translation template using | 13:47 |
| CIA-82 | msgen z3c.form.pot > en/LC_MESSAGES/z3c.form.po). | 13:47 |
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| CIA-82 | janjaapdriessen janjaapdriessen-hurry.resource * r118678 grokproject/grokproject/template/ (src/+package+/resource.py_tmpl setup.py_tmpl): Use fanstatic instead of hurry.resource. | 17:18 |
| CIA-82 | janjaapdriessen janjaapdriessen-hurry.resource * r118679 grokproject/grokproject/template/ (4 files in 2 dirs): | 17:18 |
| CIA-82 | Create two zope.conf files: A debug and a production one. This will allow you to run grok in a debug and a deploy configuration without re-running bin/buildout or messing around in parts/etc/zope.conf. | 17:18 |
| CIA-82 | Use the fanstatic middleware component that combines the injector and publisher. | 17:18 |
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| nvictor | hello all :) | 17:37 |
| nvictor | i have been reading about interfaces in java and i am very interested by them | 17:37 |
| nvictor | now i have researched them and finally landed here :) | 17:38 |
| nvictor | an upfront question, will zope's module work with python 2.5? | 17:38 |
| nvictor | google appengine is leaving me no choice | 17:38 |
| mgedmin | you mean zope.interface? it will, yes | 17:38 |
| nvictor | mgedmin: thanks God | 17:39 |
| nvictor | ok back to reading the docs | 17:39 |
| mgedmin | nobody ever called me that before :) | 17:39 |
| nvictor | mgedmin: you just saved a life (or more precisely a poor programmer soul) | 17:40 |
| nvictor | ;) | 17:40 |
| CIA-82 | tseaver * r118680 Zope/ (doc/CHANGES.rst buildout.cfg): Stopped testing non-overridden ZTK eggs in ``bin/alltests``. | 17:49 |
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| CIA-82 | tseaver 2.13 * r118681 Zope/ (doc/CHANGES.rst buildout.cfg): Stopped testing non-overridden ZTK eggs in ``bin/alltests``. | 18:03 |
| CIA-82 | janjaapdriessen janjaapdriessen-hurry.resource * r118682 grokproject/ (6 files in 4 dirs): Update tests in the resulting package to use the fanstatic layer. Fix tests. | 18:03 |
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| CIA-82 | janjaapdriessen * r118683 /grokcore.view/branches/1.13.5-without-static: Create feature branch for grokcore.view without static registration. | 18:45 |
| CIA-82 | janjaapdriessen 1.13.5-without-static * r118684 grokcore.view/src/grokcore/view/meta/directoryresource.py: Drop the StaticResourcesGrokker. | 18:45 |
| CIA-82 | tseaver * r118685 zope.structuredtext/ (10 files in 2 dirs): | 18:45 |
| CIA-82 | Removed antique copyright assertions in regression texts | 18:45 |
| CIA-82 | These assertions do not conform to repository policy. | 18:45 |
| CIA-82 | tseaver * r118686 zope.structuredtext/ (CHANGES.txt setup.py): Prepare 3.5.1 release. | 18:45 |
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| CIA-82 | tseaver * r118687 /zope.structuredtext/tags/3.5.1: Tag 3.5.1 release. | 19:13 |
| CIA-82 | tseaver * r118688 zope.structuredtext/ (CHANGES.txt setup.py): svb | 19:13 |
| CIA-82 | janjaapdriessen * r118689 /grokui.base/branches/0.4.1-fanstatic: Fanstatic for grokui.base | 19:13 |
| CIA-82 | tseaver * r118690 zope.server/ (src/zope/server/http/tests/test_wsgiserver.py CHANGES.txt): Corrected license version in ``zope/server/http/tests/test_wsgiserver.py``. | 19:13 |
| CIA-82 | tseaver * r118691 zope.server/ (CHANGES.txt setup.py): Prep 3.8.2 release. | 19:13 |
| CIA-82 | tseaver * r118692 /zope.server/tags/3.8.2: Tag 3.8.2 release. | 19:13 |
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