IRC log of #zope for Wednesday, 2011-01-26

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CIA-85benji jim-multiple-doctest * r119937 manuel/ (4 files in 2 dirs):04:39
CIA-85some small tweaks:04:39
CIA-85- whitespace04:39
CIA-85- typo04:39
CIA-85- use the more common "m" name for a manuel instead of "self"04:39
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CIA-85benji * r119938 manuel/ (4 files in 2 dirs):04:59
CIA-85merge in svn+ssh://
CIA-85(plus a small whitespace tweak)04:59
CIA-85benji * r119939 /manuel/tags/1.4.1: tag 1.4.104:59
CIA-85benji 1.4.1 * r119940 manuel/ (CHANGES.txt set version and release date) on 1.4.1 tag04:59
CIA-85benji * r119941 manuel/CHANGES.txt: fix release date04:59
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planetzopebotTrove categories for Buildout recipes and extensions (For surely there is an end ...)
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sivanghi all08:42
sivangwhat was the predecessor tool for distribute? my memory is utterly useless08:42
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avnsivang: setuptools was09:33
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sivangavn: so projects using both are in a transition state?09:44
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avnsivang: "distribute" is new name for setuptools, still use "import setuptools" and install_requires = ['setuptools']09:57
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sivangavn: ah okay, so just a name for a version line09:59
sivangavn: I was specifically wondering about Pyramid10:00
sivangso that makes this clear, thanks10:00
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HammerToe'lo all13:01
HammerToegot some deep dark BTree questions for anyone awake ;)13:01
HammerToeI'm digging into some performance issues (a Plone 3 site, ZCatalog data structures)... and I see a lot of IISet pickles being loaded, each with 55 items in them...13:02
HammerToeany idea where '55' comes from? I know there is the DEFAULT_MAX_BUCKET_SIZE, but that is set to 120 for an IIBTree.... how does IIBTree relate to an IISet? and an IITreeSet for that matter?13:02
HammerToeif I create an IISet and just keep adding values, will they all be in the same persistent object? I'm guessing yes? And is a TreeSet just a Set that splits itself into multiple sets arranged ina  btree?13:03
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betabugwhy don't you ask on #plone? some plone devs maybe know what they did there?13:14
betabug(that's for the "55" question, for the other one, let me find that link that describes this stuff...)13:15
HammerToebetabug: because I don't think it is a Plone issue, it is a Zope BTree issue13:15
betabugyeah, sure13:16
HammerToeI'm reading through the BTree C code and I can't see why IISets would always end up with 55 items in them13:16
betabugwell, you're dealing with *plone* there13:18
CIA-85thefunny42 sylvain-subscribers * r119942 grokcore.component/src/grokcore/component/ (10 files in 3 dirs): Start to add some tests on the subscriber story.13:18
HammerToebetabug: no, I'm dealing with Zope BTrees13:18
betabugin plone13:19
betabugat the end of your adventure you will discover that XY is just the way plone does things13:19
HammerToeor if you want to get picky I'm dealing with ZCatalog's FieldIndex, which uses Zope's BTrees13:19
HammerToeno it has nothing to do with Plone13:19
betabugexperience shows that "if it suxx / if it's b0rken, it's plone's fault"13:20
HammerToewhy would inserting values into a BTree and the resultant pickles that get stored in the ZODB have anything to do with Plone?13:20
betabugbecause plone messes with standard zope things13:20
betabuganyway, found this, dunno if it's the one I was looking for:
HammerToebetabug: you could argue that Plone doesn't do itself any favours storing 300,000 items of content all of which have an index value in the catalog13:20
betabugplone doesn't do favors13:21
HammerToeright, that confirms what I thought, that a TreeSet uses Sets to store the items13:21
HammerToewhat I can't find out is *why* TreeSet stores exactly 55 items in each Set13:21
betabugprobably a typo, they wanted 255 :-)13:22
HammerToebascially, if I store 300,000 items in a TreeSet, I end up with 5454 Sets created... each one a separate persistent object in the ZODB, so if I iterate that entire set then I end up loading 5454 items from the ZODB, which takes a while13:23
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HammerToebetabug: that would be a great explaination... however I bet it's wrong ;)13:23
betabughmmm, sounds contra-productive13:23
HammerToebetabug: exactly13:23
betabugsince it's all about storing huge lists13:24
HammerToeso I want to try experimenting with increasing the number of items stored in a Set... maybe to 255 ;)13:24
HammerToewell I guess the point is to try and balance the size of each persistent item in a trade off of number of items versus potential for a conflict error13:24
betabugwell, dunno if #zope-dev is still around, or was it #zope3-dev13:24
HammerToeyeah, I just asked on #zope3-dev too... no-one awake yet13:25
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woscHammerToe: you could try (probably asleep, too, though)13:29
HammerToewosc: yeah I might do that... I think I'm getting a bit closer though...13:31
HammerToean IIBTree should have a max number of items of 120... when it gets too big, it is then split into two in the middle...13:31
HammerToeso if you kept adding values in increasing order, then I think that means that you will end up with lots of buckets at MAX/2 size13:32
betabug120/2 != 5513:33
HammerToeI know...13:34
HammerToebut its as close as I got13:34
HammerToeI don't know exactly how the length is calculated, but thinking there may be some overhead or something13:34
betabugyeah well, it's close enough for the logic of it anyway13:34
HammerToeand since no-one smarter is here to tell me I'm wrong ;) :p13:35
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koshI wonder why a catalog with 300K items in it would be a performance problem for you14:20
koshhave you actually profiled the system and found out what the problem is and not just looked at objects in memory?14:20
koshI find it pretty unlikely that the catalog is a source of slowness14:20
koshat least not directly, you could have FAR too many queries running14:21
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HammerToekosh: the main reason it is slow (from what I can tell) is that quite a few data structures in the catalog end up with 300,000 items in them and many are IITreeSets which end up with around 5000 persistent objects14:31
HammerToeso if we have, say, 10 structures with that, then we have 50,000 objects *just* in the catalog structures14:31
koshhave you actually profiled the system to know that is the problem?14:33
koshand this is what showed up in the profile? that is pretty amazing14:39
koshwhat version of zope are you using? are you using zeo?14:39
CIA-85thefunny42 sylvain-subscribers * r119943 grokcore.component/README.txt: Fix RST format.14:41
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HammerToekosh: 2.10.1115:08
HammerToeand yes, I'm using ZEO15:08
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koshsame system or different system zeo server to clients?15:09
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prinzdezibelHi. Can anybody tell me if zc.buildout support conditional statements, like build this part only if you find ${section:value}?15:49
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Moo-_prinzdezibel: no15:52
Moo-_prinzdezibel: as far as I know15:52
Moo-_I would have needed that feature long time ago15:52
prinzdezibelyes, that is my impression too15:53
prinzdezibelI don't like the idea of having several config's to separate my building needs.15:54
prinzdezibelEspecially, since the person who does the buildout needs to modify some settings in my base.cfg anyway15:54
CIA-85thefunny42 sylvain-subscribers * r119944 grokcore.component/src/grokcore/component/ (7 files in 3 dirs):15:58
CIA-85Add more tests.15:58
CIA-85Support subscriber registration using decorators.15:58
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Theuni1prinzdezibel: you need to think in a reverse order16:24
Theuni1make separate/orthogonal build configs that are aggregated into a large one by selecting which ones you need16:24
Theuni1in my case I usually end up with a central buildout.cfg that doesn't even get checked in16:24
Theuni1and that only says stuff like:16:24
Theuni1extends = profiles/production.cfg profiles/zope.cfg profiles/zeo.cfg16:25
prinzdezibelyes, I have this already16:25
Theuni1the first one would contain settings, e.g. addresses and ports for the production environment16:25
Theuni1the latter says which stuff you want16:25
Theuni1they can then start modifying the parts = ... variable16:25
Theuni1or you can do stuff like parts += ${buildout:zope-parts} ${buildout:zeo-parts}16:25
prinzdezibelThat means the user does scramble his parts together in the main buildout so they meet his needs, Theuni1 ?16:27
Theuni1or an abstraction of it by providing preconfigured sets of parts16:27
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Theuni1but yea16:28
Theuni1as buildout has dependency management that isn't too dangerous anyway16:28
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Theuni1(depending on the quality of your recipes)16:28
prinzdezibelI see. Instead of letting him set variables for the buildout, he needs to choose the proper pakets that fits his neeeds.16:28
prinzdezibelGood idea. Thank you, Theuni116:28
Theuni1np, try it out and check whether it fits your needs16:29
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CIA-85shane * r119945 /relstorage/ (4 files in 4 dirs):16:37
CIA-85Fixed compatibility with ZODB 3.10. As reported by J?rgen Herrmann,16:37
CIA-85there was a problem with conflict errors. The RelStorage patch of the16:37
CIA-85sync() method now works with ZODB 3.10.16:37
CIA-85shane * r119946 relstorage/relstorage/ ( tests/ Fixed test failures and simplified the reporting units.16:37
CIA-85shane * r119947 relstorage/relstorage/ Nit: 1 MB = 1e6 bytes (and 2**20 bytes = 1 MiB)16:37
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CIA-85icemac * r119948 manuel/src/index.txt: fixed typo17:28
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CIA-85yuppie * r119949 CMF/CODINGSTYLE.txt: - added some notes about CMF specific coding issues17:55
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klawdi have a class object (type). can i check if the class has a certain interface?17:57
klawdprovidedBy returns false, implementedBy returns a typerror17:57
klawduhm. raises of course17:58
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mgedminIYourInterface.implementedBy(SomeClass) should work18:00
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mgedmincan you pastebin your code and traceback?18:00
klawdcan't paste the code, sorry18:01
klawdraise TypeError("ImplementedBy called for non-factory", cls)18:01
klawddoes this help?18:01
mgedminis cls a new-style class?18:02
* mgedmin isn't actually sure that would matter18:02
klawdit derives from object18:02
klawdzope checks if it derives from callable.18:02
klawdwhyever :|18:02
klawdi'm an idiot, sorry18:03
klawdit's actually an object of the class18:03
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klawdit's the metaclass18:09
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mgedminklawd, move the __metaclass__ *above* implements()18:12
mgedminbecause implements() is implemented through metaclasses18:12
mgedminand it tries to preserve the one you had18:13
mgedminbut if you override the __metaclass__ set by implements() later, bad things happen18:13
mgedmin(why do you need metaclasses anyway?)18:13
MrWuhi guys18:14
MrWuperhaps someone could help me with a small ZSQL issue I've found18:14
klawdas with every case you need a metaclass: it's hard to explain.18:14
MrWuin that paste I perform exactly the same SQL query against a PostgreSQL database using a ZPsycopgDA connection and a ZSQLMethod18:14
MrWu(zope 2.10.11)18:15
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MrWuif you look at it carefully, the "fecha" field is different in both results18:15
MrWuexecuting the query in the psql shell returns the correct format (dd/mm/yyyy)18:15
MrWubut the ZSQL is returning a diferent result18:16
mgedminlooks the same to me -- just the date format is different18:16
MrWuI've forced PostgreSQL to return dd/mm/yyyy18:16
mgedminI think zsql gives you DateTime objects, rather than strings18:16
MrWubut no luck with the zsql methods18:16
mgedminyou can format them as you like18:16
MrWuit could be...18:17
MrWuand is it any way to set the default format?18:17
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MrWuI mean, switch it from yyyy/mm/dd to dd/mm/yyyy18:17
MrWu(I've set date_format=international in zope.conf)18:17
MrWumy problem, basically, is that I've like... 20-30 zsql methods18:18
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mgedminI don't remember -- I don't use zope much these days18:18
MrWuand 30-40 templates (ZPT) that show the results of calling the zsql methods using traversal18:18
MrWulike http://blabla/MyZSQL/1/MyZPT18:18
MrWuI could edit all the ZPT files and replace the code that shows the result of the date field18:19
MrWubut it would be much "cleaner", easier and faster to do it in one point18:19
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mgedmincheck the docs, maybe you can find something18:21
mgedminor check the source code for the datetime class18:21
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MrWuyes, I've been trying to find out if it is something in the generic DA module, something from ZPsycopgDA or what18:25
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mgedminMrWu, you could do that via sql, I think -- cast those timestamps to varchar18:31
mgedminbut if you do it in zope, then it won't be in the DA side, it'll be on the DateTime.__str__ side18:31
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MrWumgedmin: interesting!18:33
MrWureplacing fecha_alta with fecha_alta::text in the sql query worked18:33
MrWuI didn't think about that option18:34
mgedminthat would still require editing 30 methods18:34
mgedminso I'd look for doc about zope 2 default date output formats18:34
MrWuwell, that is what I've been doing18:35
MrWuand the only way I've found to solve the problem so far is creating classes to attach the zsqlmethods to18:35
MrWuand then do the .strftime(whatever) in one method of that class18:35
MrWubut it is still a lot of work18:35
mgedminokay, I just looked at lib/python/DateTime/DateTime.py18:36
mgedminDateTime.__str__ has no configuration18:36
mgedminit always returns YYYY/MM/DD18:36
MrWulet me check18:37
MrWuI was re-checking the zope.conf directives18:37
MrWu <- datetime-format18:37
MrWuI see...18:38
MrWuso, modifying that __str__ method should do the trick18:39
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mgedminjust so you know: monkey-patching is evil and leads to problems down the line18:42
MrWubut, imho, this method should look at the datetime_format parameter in zope.conf and return date formated properly18:43
MrWuso I'll "fix" it at least for this old app of mine18:43
MrWuand then generate a patch I can save for future convenience18:44
MrWu(I could send it to zope, but anyway, 2.10.x is not the active development branch anymore, so I don't think it matters too much)18:44
mgedminyou will upgrade to 2.12 sooner or latter, I hope18:44
MrWunot sure about it18:45
mgedminsecurity support for 2.10 is not forever18:45
MrWuI'm working with django a lot more lately18:45
MrWunew developments are done with django mostly18:45
MrWuand this old app perhaps would be migrated some day18:45
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CIA-85jim * r119950 /Sandbox/J1m/customdoctests/src/zc/customdoctests/ ( Generalized api some more. Now pass in a source transformation function.19:01
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CIA-85hannosch * r119951 Products.ZCatalog/ (3 files in 3 dirs): If batching arguments are provided, limit the returned lazy sequence to the items in the required batch instead of returning trailing items falling outside of the requested batch.23:52
CIA-85hannosch * r119952 Products.ZCatalog/src/Products/ZCatalog/ Don't use a sort limit greater or equal to the resultset23:52

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