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| calk | Hello, I have an old zope installation of 2.8 and wish to migrate it to another server running zope 2.13 is that possible? and is 2.13 newer than 2.8 or its the other way around ? | 19:10 |
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| betabug | 2.13 is newer | 19:12 |
| betabug | if it's possible depends entirely on what software runs on that Zope application server | 19:12 |
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| betabug | calk: do you know what software runs on it? | 19:15 |
| betabug | calk: in case you're new to zope, this might give you an overview: http://betabug.ch/blogs/ch-athens/1217 | 19:16 |
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| kosh | betabug, how goes life? | 19:26 |
| kosh | betabug, some of my classes are HARD | 19:26 |
| kosh | on thursdays I have about 6 hours of applied quantum mechanics :) | 19:27 |
| betabug | hey kosh | 19:28 |
| betabug | kosh: in german? | 19:28 |
| kosh | all english | 19:28 |
| kosh | my professors have said the words for engineering are pretty much all english especially the high tech stuff and nobody wants to translate that into german | 19:29 |
| kosh | besides out of my entire class only 4 of them speak german | 19:29 |
| kosh | if the class was all in german they would have had far fewer people available | 19:30 |
| kosh | they had about 300 applicants and only 27 students made it through :) | 19:32 |
| kosh | so tomorrow morning my real classes start | 19:39 |
| kosh | numerical methods for solving PDEs and parallel programming | 19:39 |
| calk | betabug: its some web application, not sure if its running directly from zope or another thing. my plan is to move mysql, pgsql and zope and pray that everything runs as expected | 19:39 |
| calk | betabug: would it be possible that no cms/framework running on zope and its native/pure development ? | 19:40 |
| kosh | I think more and more now I would make my systems run in a vm and then just migrate that vm | 19:40 |
| calk | betabug: after looking around i found /usr/local/project_name which have list of .py files which i believe are the project's files running from there | 19:41 |
| calk | rest of the things such as templates are inside zope | 19:41 |
| betabug | hmm, /usr/local/project_name doesn't sound at all like typical Zope application files | 19:42 |
| kosh | so you don't know zope and you have to migrate a zope app? | 19:42 |
| kosh | betabug, the fun of people playing with the path probably | 19:43 |
| betabug | I guess those are some scripts set up to manage the instance | 19:43 |
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| betabug | start / stop / restart or so | 19:43 |
| kosh | betabug, so just remember when you are suffering at work that at least you are not doing applied quantum mechanics | 19:43 |
| betabug | calk: I guess reading that blog post would be a good starting point | 19:44 |
| betabug | kosh: hahahaha | 19:44 |
| calk | betabug: yeah i'm reading, reached half way through :) thanks | 19:44 |
| betabug | kosh: you just want all the fun of building a nano-godzilla-army all by yourself! | 19:44 |
| kosh | one of my coworkers at amgen actually joked about that by saying that 5 years ago applied quantum mechanics did not even exist | 19:44 |
| kosh | betabug, it helps relieve stress! | 19:45 |
| calk | ouch | 19:46 |
| calk | " The Python world has moved on in the last few years and the Zope code with it. You might be in for some rewriting, for some bugfixing or just for some re-packaging." | 19:46 |
| calk | if i want to skip this, is it possible? | 19:46 |
| betabug | calk: "might" | 19:46 |
| betabug | you also might be able to just move things over, nobody can tell without looking and/or trying | 19:46 |
| betabug | as the proverb says: make backups and carry a big stick | 19:47 |
| kosh | also jack daniels | 19:47 |
| kosh | you might need a case of that | 19:47 |
| calk | old system runs on python 2.4.3 newer runs on 2.7 | 19:47 |
| calk | moving folders and running things seems wont work | 19:47 |
| betabug | the python version I think is the least problem | 19:48 |
| kosh | oh geeze | 19:48 |
| kosh | the zope versions across that much time will NOT be compatible | 19:48 |
| calk | if its up to me i don't want to upgrade zope and keep old things running till i move to newer idea i have in mind | 19:48 |
| calk | old system running zope28 | 19:48 |
| kosh | the zope versions that went with 2.4 and 2.7 have different catalog layouts | 19:48 |
| calk | newer i can install anything i want | 19:48 |
| kosh | I think that needs to be a staged upgraded IIRC | 19:48 |
| calk | i installed one from ports and its 2.13 | 19:48 |
| kosh | I know I don't have the docs for that stuff anymore | 19:48 |
| calk | old server freebsd 5.4 newer server freebsd 9.3 | 19:49 |
| betabug | kosh: I moved my zope from 2.9 to 2.13, without much trouble | 19:49 |
| betabug | but I did have to change some code in some of the Products used | 19:49 |
| betabug | some imports had moved etc. | 19:49 |
| kosh | I thought it was 2.8 to 2.9 that had the upgrade or it was 2.7 to 2.8 | 19:49 |
| kosh | yeah definitely have to clean up imports, I had a few security assertions to change also | 19:49 |
| calk | same goes for pgsql old box is 8.1.2 newer is 8.4.19 | 19:50 |
| calk | old mysql 4.0.x newer 5.1.x | 19:50 |
| betabug | calk: the biggest question will be where your actual code is, what kind of app it is | 19:50 |
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| calk | betabug: its at /usr/local/my_project_name | 19:51 |
| betabug | try to find the instance folder, check Products in there and External methods | 19:51 |
| calk | found it | 19:51 |
| calk | /usr/local/www/Zope28/instances/my_project_name | 19:52 |
| kosh | I wonder if there are any zclasses | 19:52 |
| * kosh hands betabug a pan galactic gargle blaster to help deal with repressed memories | 19:52 | |
| calk | how do i find mysql/pgsql configurations in zope to know which db its using to dump/move it over and set the correct credentials? | 19:52 |
| betabug | kosh: yeah, encountering some zclasses would need me drinking that :-D | 19:52 |
| calk | folders are small at /usr/local/www/Zope28/instances/my_project_name only log folder is 12GB with two logs accumulating since 2006 | 19:53 |
| kosh | http://yourserver.com/manage and look at the sql db adapeters that are in there | 19:53 |
| betabug | calk: you are most interested in the contens of a folder called Products | 19:53 |
| betabug | and the one with the external methods | 19:53 |
| betabug | dunno how that was called | 19:54 |
| calk | Extensions is empty with one README.txt | 19:54 |
| kosh | do you remember how to tell if a system uses zclasses anymore? | 19:54 |
| kosh | I know it is in Control Panel/Products in the management interface | 19:54 |
| kosh | and they had some kind of different icon in there | 19:54 |
| calk | products folder has: LocalizerREADME.txtZMySQLDAZPsycopgDAiHotfix | 19:54 |
| calk | err | 19:55 |
| calk | Localizer README.txt ZMySQLDA ZPsycopgDA iHotfix | 19:55 |
| betabug | kosh: don't remember, but I think the ZClasses were in Control Panels/Products, as you say | 19:55 |
| kosh | so nothing but basic products ... | 19:55 |
| kosh | I have a bad feeling about this | 19:55 |
| betabug | I guess a bunch of dtml methods and zsql... unless there are zclasses | 19:56 |
| betabug | in which case I guess you would wish you were with kosh in his quantum mechanics class, as you had a better chance to understand that one | 19:56 |
| kosh | calk, can you log into the backend of your website and then click on Control Panel and then Products and take a screenshot of the page that comes up and put that somewhere we can see it | 19:57 |
| kosh | if he has zclasses he is basically screwed | 19:57 |
| kosh | for that you rebuild the product in python and figure out a way to export and reimport the data | 19:57 |
| betabug | yepp | 19:58 |
| calk | kosh: sure one min | 19:58 |
| kosh | betabug, right now I feel like Agent K in men in black when he took a sample and kept saying not green please not green to the device | 19:58 |
| betabug | hahahaha | 19:59 |
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| kosh | I used to use zclasses long long long ago | 19:59 |
| betabug | kosh: but we should have the memory zapper too then | 19:59 |
| kosh | around zope 2.0 or so I think but I stopped by 2.2 or so | 19:59 |
| betabug | me too, in one project, rewrote it all though | 19:59 |
| betabug | shortly before the company folded | 19:59 |
| betabug | ours was with 2.5 | 20:00 |
| betabug | what can I say? I was young, clueless, and needed the money | 20:00 |
| kosh | now you are older, wiser and still need the money | 20:01 |
| betabug | I'm not so sure about the "wiser" part | 20:01 |
| kosh | benefit of the doubt | 20:01 |
| kosh | that is why I am happy I am getting out | 20:02 |
| betabug | yeah | 20:02 |
| kosh | it is just part of the cost of getting out is applied quantum mechanics | 20:02 |
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| calk | back | 20:03 |
| betabug | I guess for you quantum mechanics is having all the fun without having the management bullsh*t bingo | 20:03 |
| calk | what page you wanted me to screenshot again? | 20:03 |
| calk | btw under storage tehre is mysql, postgresql and zodb | 20:03 |
| kosh | in the Control Panel click on Products and take a screenshot of that | 20:04 |
| calk | I dont see Products | 20:04 |
| kosh | Product Management maybe? | 20:04 |
| calk | i think i need to remove www as when i login with www in the URL i see something and without www i see lsit of projects or so | 20:05 |
| betabug | I guess you are in the wrong place | 20:05 |
| betabug | you want to go to yourdomain.com/manage | 20:05 |
| calk | ok now i see Control_Panel acl_users projects temp_folder | 20:06 |
| calk | top tabs i seecontents view properties security undo ownershipfind | 20:06 |
| betabug | click on Control_Panel | 20:06 |
| calk | ok? | 20:06 |
| betabug | and inside that would be Products | 20:06 |
| calk | correct | 20:07 |
| calk | open it an screenshot ? | 20:07 |
| betabug | sure | 20:07 |
| calk | https://tmpdmp.com/59277d0a157f29be/32295030bf893c0d | 20:08 |
| kosh | instead of clicking on the plus click on Products | 20:09 |
| kosh | that will change the content in the main area and then take a picture of that | 20:09 |
| betabug | calk: looks like today's your lucky day, no ZClasses | 20:10 |
| kosh | what is zwiki? I did not see it in the products folder he listed earlier | 20:10 |
| kosh | weren't early versions done with zclasses? | 20:10 |
| betabug | don't think so | 20:10 |
| calk | ok one min | 20:11 |
| betabug | but there is other stuff that should be in the Products folder, that he didn't mention | 20:11 |
| betabug | ZReST, ZWiki | 20:12 |
| calk | https://tmpdmp.com/171308b02798820a/64dc2d1f6158dea6 | 20:12 |
| betabug | don't remember Trancience, dunno what that is | 20:13 |
| betabug | Transience | 20:13 |
| betabug | I guess if it was me, I'd identify installed products, hunt down latest versions | 20:14 |
| kosh | nothing looks like a zclass | 20:14 |
| calk | clicked it and got Help (Zope Help) | 20:14 |
| betabug | then copy everything to new instance, try to set up new sql dbs and connections | 20:15 |
| calk | nothing more | 20:15 |
| kosh | but that leaves the question of where the heack is zwiki and zreset installed on this system | 20:15 |
| betabug | calk: could it be possible you forgot to list them when you looked at Products on the file system? | 20:15 |
| calk | betabug: you mean copy the /usr/local/www/Zope28/instances/my_project_name to the new server , import sql of mysql and pgsql and try ? | 20:15 |
| calk | betabug: no i just did ls and copy pasted | 20:16 |
| calk | want me to look again carefully ? | 20:16 |
| betabug | calk: no, you would need to try find the latest versions of the Products (ZPsycoPGA, ZWiki, ZGadflyDA, ...) | 20:16 |
| calk | there is a folder outside the instances called Products | 20:17 |
| calk | has different listing than Products folder inside instances | 20:17 |
| betabug | I guess if you didn't saw ZWiki, maybe you looked in the wrong place? | 20:17 |
| calk | ZWiki is available in the outside folder | 20:17 |
| calk | (/usr/local/www/Zope28/Products)ls | 20:17 |
| calk | 00readme-freebsd.txtTranslationServiceZWiki | 20:17 |
| calk | LocalizerZMySQLDAiHotfix-0.6.1 | 20:17 |
| betabug | hmm, dunno how that could work if it was outside | 20:17 |
| calk | (/usr/local/www/Zope28/Products)ls | 20:18 |
| calk | 00readme-freebsd.txtTranslationServiceZWiki | 20:18 |
| calk | Localizer ZMySQLDA iHotfix-0.6.1 | 20:18 |
| betabug | well, for all those products you would need the latest versions | 20:18 |
| calk | sorry | 20:18 |
| calk | thats the correct one | 20:18 |
| calk | (/usr/local/www/Zope28/Products)ls | 20:18 |
| calk | 00readme-freebsd.txt TranslationService ZWiki | 20:18 |
| calk | Localizer ZMySQLDA iHotfix-0.6.1 | 20:18 |
| betabug | then build up a new instance with 2.13 | 20:18 |
| betabug | copy over the Data.fs and the sql data | 20:18 |
| calk | its not possible to use same old versions ? | 20:18 |
| betabug | calk: unlikely | 20:19 |
| calk | what about 2.8 source and build it from scratch | 20:19 |
| calk | or bad idea to keep old things running from security point of view? | 20:19 |
| betabug | dunno if Zope 2.8 required Python 2.3 or 2.4 | 20:19 |
| betabug | calk: well, security... IIRC it wasn't so bad, but you never know | 20:20 |
| calk | i can downgrade or have separate python 2.4 installation on /opt for example specifically for zope | 20:20 |
| betabug | yeah, you could install python 2.4 and manually install Zope 2.8, sure | 20:20 |
| betabug | you'd have to try to put things together and see what errors you might get | 20:20 |
| calk | ok | 20:21 |
| betabug | nobody can tell you in advance | 20:21 |
| calk | where can i find old tarbal of 2.8 online? | 20:21 |
| betabug | hmm | 20:21 |
| betabug | http://old.zope.org/Products/Zope/swpackage_releases | 20:23 |
| betabug | choose the last existing 2.8 tarball | 20:24 |
| calk | ok | 20:24 |
| calk | what about db credentials, i can find them from /manage ? | 20:24 |
| calk | or some file in shell? | 20:24 |
| betabug | you will need to find them from /manage | 20:25 |
| calk | inside the project databases or under control_panel ? | 20:25 |
| betabug | they will be moved over with the Data.fs | 20:25 |
| betabug | dunno, I didn't use sql with zope | 20:25 |
| kosh | calk, zope is mostly managed from the gui not the files | 20:26 |
| calk | when i click on the project > storage > MySQL i get list of things which they seem to be sql or tables | 20:26 |
| calk | but they are all dated 2012-02-19 | 20:26 |
| calk | and inside PostgreSQL one file also init_01_01.sql also dated to same 2012-02-19 | 20:27 |
| calk | and ZODB also lots of things with snake icon i think dated 2012-02-19 | 20:27 |
| betabug | dinner time here | 20:27 |
| betabug | good luck calk, hf there! :-) | 20:28 |
| calk | when i hover the snake icon i get Script (Python) | 20:28 |
| betabug | cya kosh! | 20:28 |
| calk | Thanks betabug, have a good meal :) | 20:28 |
| kosh | have fun | 20:28 |
| kosh | remember the garlic butter goes on the babies! | 20:28 |
| calk | so kosh db credentials are supposed to be in one of those files/folders? | 20:30 |
| kosh | they will be inside the db somewhere | 20:30 |
| kosh | you would have to find them inside the zope management interface | 20:30 |
| calk | the Data.fs u mean? | 20:30 |
| kosh | I don't know where though | 20:30 |
| kosh | inside the web interface | 20:30 |
| calk | ok | 20:32 |
| kosh | back in a little while | 20:37 |
| calk | what about ZODB does it also have credentials or coping the instance folder will have its credentials with it ? | 20:40 |
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