IRC log of #zope for Sunday, 2014-10-12

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calkHello, I have an old zope installation of 2.8 and wish to migrate it to another server running zope 2.13 is that possible? and is 2.13 newer than 2.8 or its the other way around ?19:10
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betabug2.13 is newer19:12
betabugif it's possible depends entirely on what software runs on that Zope application server19:12
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betabugcalk: do you know what software runs on it?19:15
betabugcalk: in case you're new to zope, this might give you an overview:
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koshbetabug, how goes life?19:26
koshbetabug, some of my classes are HARD19:26
koshon thursdays I have about 6 hours of applied quantum mechanics :)19:27
betabughey kosh19:28
betabugkosh: in german?19:28
koshall english19:28
koshmy professors have said the words for engineering are pretty much all english especially the high tech stuff and nobody wants to translate that into german19:29
koshbesides out of my entire class only 4 of them speak german19:29
koshif the class was all in german they would have had far fewer people available19:30
koshthey had about 300 applicants and only 27 students made it through :)19:32
koshso tomorrow morning my real classes start19:39
koshnumerical methods for solving PDEs and parallel programming19:39
calkbetabug: its some web application, not sure if its running directly from zope or another thing. my plan is to move mysql, pgsql and zope and pray that everything runs as expected19:39
calkbetabug: would it be possible that no cms/framework running on zope and its native/pure development ?19:40
koshI think more and more now I would make my systems run in a vm and then just migrate that vm19:40
calkbetabug: after looking around i found /usr/local/project_name which have list of .py files which i believe are the project's files running from there19:41
calkrest of the things such as templates are inside zope19:41
betabughmm, /usr/local/project_name doesn't sound at all like typical Zope application files19:42
koshso you don't know zope and you have to migrate a zope app?19:42
koshbetabug, the fun of people playing with the path probably19:43
betabugI guess those are some scripts set up to manage the instance19:43
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betabugstart / stop / restart or so19:43
koshbetabug, so just remember when you are suffering at work that at least you are not doing applied quantum mechanics19:43
betabugcalk: I guess reading that blog post would be a good starting point19:44
betabugkosh: hahahaha19:44
calkbetabug: yeah i'm reading, reached half way through :) thanks19:44
betabugkosh: you just want all the fun of building a nano-godzilla-army all by yourself!19:44
koshone of my coworkers at amgen actually joked about that by saying that 5 years ago applied quantum mechanics did not even exist19:44
koshbetabug, it helps relieve stress!19:45
calk" The Python world has moved on in the last few years and the Zope code with it. You might be in for some rewriting, for some bugfixing or just for some re-packaging."19:46
calkif i want to skip this, is it possible?19:46
betabugcalk: "might"19:46
betabugyou also might be able to just move things over, nobody can tell without looking and/or trying19:46
betabugas the proverb says: make backups and carry a big stick19:47
koshalso jack daniels19:47
koshyou might need a case of that19:47
calkold system runs on python 2.4.3 newer runs on 2.719:47
calkmoving folders and running things seems wont work19:47
betabugthe python version I think is the least problem19:48
koshoh geeze19:48
koshthe zope versions across that much time will NOT be compatible19:48
calkif its up to me i don't want to upgrade zope and keep old things running till i move to newer idea i have in mind19:48
calkold system running zope2819:48
koshthe zope versions that went with 2.4 and 2.7 have different catalog layouts19:48
calknewer i can install anything i want19:48
koshI think that needs to be a staged upgraded IIRC19:48
calki installed one from ports and its 2.1319:48
koshI know I don't have the docs for that stuff anymore19:48
calkold server freebsd 5.4 newer server freebsd 9.319:49
betabugkosh: I moved my zope from 2.9 to 2.13, without much trouble19:49
betabugbut I did have to change some code in some of the Products used19:49
betabugsome imports had moved etc.19:49
koshI thought it was 2.8 to 2.9 that had the upgrade or it was 2.7 to 2.819:49
koshyeah definitely have to clean up imports, I had a few security assertions to change also19:49
calksame goes for pgsql old box is 8.1.2 newer is 8.4.1919:50
calkold mysql 4.0.x newer 5.1.x19:50
betabugcalk: the biggest question will be where your actual code is, what kind of app it is19:50
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calkbetabug: its at /usr/local/my_project_name19:51
betabugtry to find the instance folder, check Products in there and External methods19:51
calkfound it19:51
calk /usr/local/www/Zope28/instances/my_project_name19:52
koshI wonder if there are any zclasses19:52
* kosh hands betabug a pan galactic gargle blaster to help deal with repressed memories19:52
calkhow do i find mysql/pgsql configurations in zope to know which db its using to dump/move it over and set the correct credentials?19:52
betabugkosh: yeah, encountering some zclasses would need me drinking that :-D19:52
calkfolders are small at /usr/local/www/Zope28/instances/my_project_name only log folder is 12GB with two logs accumulating since 200619:53
kosh and look at the sql db adapeters that are in there19:53
betabugcalk: you are most interested in the contens of a folder called Products19:53
betabugand the one with the external methods19:53
betabugdunno how that was called19:54
calkExtensions is empty with one README.txt19:54
koshdo you remember how to tell if a system uses zclasses anymore?19:54
koshI know it is in Control Panel/Products in the management interface19:54
koshand they had some kind of different icon in there19:54
calkproducts folder has: LocalizerREADME.txtZMySQLDAZPsycopgDAiHotfix19:54
calkLocalizer README.txt ZMySQLDA ZPsycopgDA iHotfix19:55
betabugkosh: don't remember, but I think the ZClasses were in Control Panels/Products, as you say19:55
koshso nothing but basic products ...19:55
koshI have a bad feeling about this19:55
betabugI guess a bunch of dtml methods and zsql... unless there are zclasses19:56
betabugin which case I guess you would wish you were with kosh in his quantum mechanics class, as you had a better chance to understand that one19:56
koshcalk, can you log into the backend of your website and then click on Control Panel and then Products and take a screenshot of the page that comes up and put that somewhere we can see it19:57
koshif he has zclasses he is basically screwed19:57
koshfor that you rebuild the product in python and figure out a way to export and reimport the data19:57
calkkosh: sure one min19:58
koshbetabug, right now I feel like Agent K in men in black when he took a sample and kept saying not green please not green to the device19:58
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koshI used to use zclasses long long long ago19:59
betabugkosh: but we should have the memory zapper too then19:59
kosharound zope 2.0 or so I think but I stopped by 2.2 or so19:59
betabugme too, in one project, rewrote it all though19:59
betabugshortly before the company folded19:59
betabugours was with 2.520:00
betabugwhat can I say? I was young, clueless, and needed the money20:00
koshnow you are older, wiser and still need the money20:01
betabugI'm not so sure about the "wiser" part20:01
koshbenefit of the doubt20:01
koshthat is why I am happy I am getting out20:02
koshit is just part of the cost of getting out is applied quantum mechanics20:02
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betabugI guess for you quantum mechanics is having all the fun without having the management bullsh*t bingo20:03
calkwhat page you wanted me to screenshot again?20:03
calkbtw under storage tehre is mysql, postgresql and zodb20:03
koshin the Control Panel click on Products and take a screenshot of that20:04
calkI dont see Products20:04
koshProduct Management  maybe?20:04
calki think i need to remove www as when i login with www in the URL i see something and without www i see lsit of projects or so20:05
betabugI guess you are in the wrong place20:05
betabugyou want to go to
calkok now i see Control_Panel acl_users projects temp_folder20:06
calktop tabs i seecontents view properties security undo ownershipfind20:06
betabugclick on Control_Panel20:06
betabugand inside that would be Products20:06
calkopen it an screenshot ?20:07
koshinstead of clicking on the plus click on Products20:09
koshthat will change the content in the main area and then take a picture of that20:09
betabugcalk: looks like today's your lucky day, no ZClasses20:10
koshwhat is zwiki? I did not see it in the products folder he listed earlier20:10
koshweren't early versions done with zclasses?20:10
betabugdon't think so20:10
calkok one min20:11
betabugbut there is other stuff that should be in the Products folder, that he didn't mention20:11
betabugZReST, ZWiki20:12
betabugdon't remember Trancience, dunno what that is20:13
betabugI guess if it was me, I'd identify installed products, hunt down latest versions20:14
koshnothing looks like a zclass20:14
calkclicked it and got Help (Zope Help)20:14
betabugthen copy everything to new instance, try to set up new sql dbs and connections20:15
calknothing more20:15
koshbut that leaves the question of where the heack is zwiki and zreset installed on this system20:15
betabugcalk: could it be possible you forgot to list them when you looked at Products on the file system?20:15
calkbetabug: you mean copy the /usr/local/www/Zope28/instances/my_project_name to the new server , import sql of mysql and pgsql and try ?20:15
calkbetabug: no i just did ls and copy pasted20:16
calkwant me to look again carefully ?20:16
betabugcalk: no, you would need to try find the latest versions of the Products (ZPsycoPGA, ZWiki, ZGadflyDA, ...)20:16
calkthere is a folder outside the instances called Products20:17
calkhas different listing than Products folder inside instances20:17
betabugI guess if you didn't saw ZWiki, maybe you looked in the wrong place?20:17
calkZWiki is available in the outside folder20:17
betabughmm, dunno how that could work if it was outside20:17
calkLocalizer                ZMySQLDA                iHotfix-0.6.120:18
betabugwell, for all those products you would need the latest versions20:18
calkthats the correct one20:18
calk00readme-freebsd.txt       TranslationService         ZWiki20:18
calkLocalizer                ZMySQLDA                iHotfix-0.6.120:18
betabugthen build up a new instance with 2.1320:18
betabugcopy over the Data.fs and the sql data20:18
calkits not possible to use same old versions ?20:18
betabugcalk: unlikely20:19
calkwhat about 2.8 source and build it from scratch20:19
calkor bad idea to keep old things running from security point of view?20:19
betabugdunno if Zope 2.8 required Python 2.3 or 2.420:19
betabugcalk: well, security... IIRC it wasn't so bad, but you never know20:20
calki can downgrade or have separate python 2.4 installation on /opt for example specifically for zope20:20
betabugyeah, you could install python 2.4 and manually install Zope 2.8, sure20:20
betabugyou'd have to try to put things together and see what errors you might get20:20
betabugnobody can tell you in advance20:21
calkwhere can i find old tarbal of 2.8 online?20:21
betabugchoose the last existing 2.8 tarball20:24
calkwhat about db credentials, i can find them from /manage ?20:24
calkor some file in shell?20:24
betabugyou will need to find them from /manage20:25
calkinside the project databases or under control_panel ?20:25
betabugthey will be moved over with the Data.fs20:25
betabugdunno, I didn't use sql with zope20:25
koshcalk, zope is mostly managed from the gui not the files20:26
calkwhen i click on the project > storage > MySQL i get list of things which they seem to be sql or tables20:26
calkbut they are all dated 2012-02-1920:26
calkand inside PostgreSQL one file also init_01_01.sql also dated to same 2012-02-1920:27
calkand ZODB also lots of things with snake icon i think dated 2012-02-1920:27
betabugdinner time here20:27
betabuggood luck calk, hf there! :-)20:28
calkwhen i hover the snake icon i get Script (Python)20:28
betabugcya kosh!20:28
calkThanks betabug, have a good meal :)20:28
koshhave fun20:28
koshremember the garlic butter goes on the babies!20:28
calkso kosh db credentials are supposed to be in one of those files/folders?20:30
koshthey will be inside the db somewhere20:30
koshyou would have to find them inside the zope management interface20:30
calkthe Data.fs u mean?20:30
koshI don't know where though20:30
koshinside the web interface20:30
koshback in a little while20:37
calkwhat about ZODB does it also have credentials or coping the instance folder will have its credentials with it ?20:40
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