IRC log of #zope3-dev for Wednesday, 2006-01-04

J1mwell, they don't00:00
srichterok, I ran them last week00:00
srichterprobably something changed, which I did not think about00:00
srichterI am running them now00:00
srichterI am running them00:01
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einsromanofski hi12:09
romanofskihi eins :)12:13
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AJCwhat is z3lab powered by?14:10
AJCi mean the blogs, etc.14:10
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yotaAJC: CPS14:28
d2mAJC: heres the source
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einsis there any way to track security errors?14:41
romanofskiyeah - the debug skin show you security errors14:43
einsmmm I'm using my own skin14:47
romanofskiyou can include the debug skin in yours14:48
romanofskiactually I'm not sure if I'm using the correct term here... probably I'm talking about a skin layer14:49
einsthanks, good idea actually:)14:50
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AJCthanks d2m, yota... i'll take a look.14:55
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andresjinty, bha, sqlobject is slow. It takes ages to create 15000 objects...15:38
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andresor hm, its not taking ages. Its shorter than i thought. 3s on the first creation 1.5 afterwards (out of cache). The slow thing is to render the Set as it seems...15:47
jintyandres: ha, a case of "it's SQL, it must be the slow part!"15:51
andresjinty, no, i thought the object creation would be the expensive part.15:52
jintyandres: ok, nice to know anyway (the fast part I mean).15:55
andresjinty, well it could be faster ;-)15:55
encolpesrichter: Simon Doesn't remember if he can commit in Zope3 for the i18nextract patch15:58
srichterencolpe: ok15:58
srichterencolpe: I already did the merge (needed some test fixes as well), and I'll refer to his site that agreed to publish the code under ZPL15:59
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andresjinty, others, any idea, my speed problems boil down to this: If i create a new container and iterate over its contents, its fast. If i get an existing container out of zodb its slow. 1.8s vs 28s16:35
andresAs the contents come out of an sql database they have exactly the same content.16:35
andresThats seems very strange to me.16:36
andresHm, the securityProxy causes this.16:39
andresI knew, that security is expensive, but THAT expensive...16:40
srichterit sounds very strage to me that security would be that expensive16:42
srichterit certainly is alarming16:43
srichterit would be good to report your findings at zope3-dev16:43
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andressrichter, well, that are 15000 elements, so its somewhat understandeable.16:46
andresfor each of them 3 attributes needs to be checked.16:47
andresso its 45000 security checks.16:47
andresplus for each container access one.16:47
srichterstill, maybe we should create a security cache or something16:48
andressrichter, whats more expensive, a security check or putting an object into an security Proxy?16:49
srichterno clue16:53
srichterI am not a security expert16:53
andressrichter, thats J1m?16:53
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srichteryep :-)16:54
srichteror Theuni16:54
* Theuni reads17:00
SteveAwhy are you doing 45000 security checks?17:00
SteveAdoes each check involve a database query?17:00
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SteveAwhy do you iterate over 15000 elements of anything on a single page?17:00
J1mNote that the security policy is already doing quite a bit of caching.17:01
J1mOf course security checks are somewhat expensive.17:02
andresSteveA, because there are 15000 objects displayed on a site.17:02
SteveAyou may want to tell sqlobject to bring in the attributes you use for security checking as part of the default query for that row17:02
J1mFor normal applications, they aren't dominant.17:02
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andresSteveA, there are no sql queries done in that time.17:02
andresSteveA, its just security out of zcml.17:03
SteveAso, if you set the security to zope.Public...#17:07
SteveAdoes it take about 0 time?17:07
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andresSteveA, hm, even if i set it to zope.Public, there will be a check, or?17:08
SteveAzope.Public is special.  it makes a shortcut to avoid the checks.17:09
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andresSteveA, its still a bit slower than without securityProxy but way faster than with real permissions.17:12
SteveAso this tells you that most of the time is spend in deciding whether a permission is allowed for a particular object17:14
SteveAand the rest of the security infrastructure, such as putting the content objects inside proxies, and accessing them, doesn't take so much time17:14
andresSteveA, yes, but its plain zcml security for now. So its just getting worse in future :-(17:16
SteveAi'm not sure what you mean by "plain zcml security"17:17
SteveAin zcml, you can say that particular attribute names require certain permissions in order to be accessed17:17
andresi mean, that everything is defined in zcml and not retrieved for example out of a sql database.17:18
SteveAto see if the current user has a given permission, the security authorization policy looks to see what the current principal is (the current logged in user), and asks what grants that principal has.17:18
SteveAit is not common to want to deal with 15000 objects all at once with zope3.  so, i expect you can do some special things with your design or security to make the security better for your particular case.  For example, perhaps you can render this 15000 objects page based not on the "real" objects, but instead on stub objects with zope.Public security17:21
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andresSteveA, well, i will have to do something... Then problem is that i have to check if people have access to certain objects, but as security should be in the sql database anyway (or better said, is, but just ignored for now) i will do it directly i think.17:25
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andreswith directly i mean in the query.17:28
andresFor now i will just remove the Security Proxy.17:28
andresStupid Question: After removing a proxy from a container no object out of that container is in a proxy. How can i put them into a Proxy again/How to i get the checker for that?17:37
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andresj-w, thanks.17:41
andresJ1m, i mean.17:41
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MacYEThappy new year18:48
benjiHappy New Year to you too, MacYET18:50
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