| J1m | well, they don't | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| srichter | ok, I ran them last week | 00:00 |
| srichter | probably something changed, which I did not think about | 00:00 |
| srichter | I am running them now | 00:00 |
| J1m | http://buildbot.zope.org:8002/ | 00:01 |
| srichter | I am running them | 00:01 |
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| eins | hi | 08:22 |
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| romanofski | moin | 10:34 |
| efrerich | moin | 10:42 |
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| encolpe | Hi | 11:28 |
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| eins | romanofski hi | 12:09 |
| romanofski | hi eins :) | 12:13 |
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| AJC | what is z3lab powered by? | 14:10 |
| AJC | i mean the blogs, etc. | 14:10 |
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| yota | AJC: CPS | 14:28 |
| d2m | AJC: heres the source http://svn.z3lab.org/trac/z3lab/browser/Z3LabSite/trunk/ | 14:28 |
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| eins | is there any way to track security errors? | 14:41 |
| romanofski | yeah - the debug skin show you security errors | 14:43 |
| eins | mmm I'm using my own skin | 14:47 |
| romanofski | you can include the debug skin in yours | 14:48 |
| romanofski | actually I'm not sure if I'm using the correct term here... probably I'm talking about a skin layer | 14:49 |
| eins | thanks, good idea actually:) | 14:50 |
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| AJC | thanks d2m, yota... i'll take a look. | 14:55 |
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| andres | jinty, bha, sqlobject is slow. It takes ages to create 15000 objects... | 15:38 |
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| andres | or hm, its not taking ages. Its shorter than i thought. 3s on the first creation 1.5 afterwards (out of cache). The slow thing is to render the Set as it seems... | 15:47 |
| jinty | andres: ha, a case of "it's SQL, it must be the slow part!" | 15:51 |
| andres | jinty, no, i thought the object creation would be the expensive part. | 15:52 |
| jinty | andres: ok, nice to know anyway (the fast part I mean). | 15:55 |
| andres | jinty, well it could be faster ;-) | 15:55 |
| encolpe | srichter: Simon Doesn't remember if he can commit in Zope3 for the i18nextract patch | 15:58 |
| srichter | encolpe: ok | 15:58 |
| srichter | encolpe: I already did the merge (needed some test fixes as well), and I'll refer to his site that agreed to publish the code under ZPL | 15:59 |
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| encolpe | Ok | 16:08 |
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| andres | jinty, others, any idea, my speed problems boil down to this: If i create a new container and iterate over its contents, its fast. If i get an existing container out of zodb its slow. 1.8s vs 28s | 16:35 |
| andres | As the contents come out of an sql database they have exactly the same content. | 16:35 |
| andres | Thats seems very strange to me. | 16:36 |
| andres | Hm, the securityProxy causes this. | 16:39 |
| andres | I knew, that security is expensive, but THAT expensive... | 16:40 |
| srichter | it sounds very strage to me that security would be that expensive | 16:42 |
| srichter | it certainly is alarming | 16:43 |
| srichter | it would be good to report your findings at zope3-dev | 16:43 |
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| andres | srichter, well, that are 15000 elements, so its somewhat understandeable. | 16:46 |
| andres | for each of them 3 attributes needs to be checked. | 16:47 |
| andres | so its 45000 security checks. | 16:47 |
| srichter | ok | 16:47 |
| andres | plus for each container access one. | 16:47 |
| srichter | right | 16:47 |
| srichter | still, maybe we should create a security cache or something | 16:48 |
| andres | srichter, whats more expensive, a security check or putting an object into an security Proxy? | 16:49 |
| srichter | no clue | 16:53 |
| srichter | I am not a security expert | 16:53 |
| andres | srichter, thats J1m? | 16:53 |
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| srichter | yep :-) | 16:54 |
| srichter | or Theuni | 16:54 |
| Theuni | huh? | 16:59 |
| * Theuni reads | 17:00 | |
| SteveA | why are you doing 45000 security checks? | 17:00 |
| SteveA | does each check involve a database query? | 17:00 |
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| SteveA | why do you iterate over 15000 elements of anything on a single page? | 17:00 |
| J1m | Note that the security policy is already doing quite a bit of caching. | 17:01 |
| J1m | Of course security checks are somewhat expensive. | 17:02 |
| andres | SteveA, because there are 15000 objects displayed on a site. | 17:02 |
| SteveA | you may want to tell sqlobject to bring in the attributes you use for security checking as part of the default query for that row | 17:02 |
| J1m | For normal applications, they aren't dominant. | 17:02 |
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| andres | SteveA, there are no sql queries done in that time. | 17:02 |
| andres | SteveA, its just security out of zcml. | 17:03 |
| SteveA | so, if you set the security to zope.Public...# | 17:07 |
| SteveA | does it take about 0 time? | 17:07 |
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| andres | SteveA, hm, even if i set it to zope.Public, there will be a check, or? | 17:08 |
| SteveA | zope.Public is special. it makes a shortcut to avoid the checks. | 17:09 |
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| andres | SteveA, its still a bit slower than without securityProxy but way faster than with real permissions. | 17:12 |
| SteveA | so this tells you that most of the time is spend in deciding whether a permission is allowed for a particular object | 17:14 |
| SteveA | and the rest of the security infrastructure, such as putting the content objects inside proxies, and accessing them, doesn't take so much time | 17:14 |
| andres | SteveA, yes, but its plain zcml security for now. So its just getting worse in future :-( | 17:16 |
| SteveA | i'm not sure what you mean by "plain zcml security" | 17:17 |
| SteveA | in zcml, you can say that particular attribute names require certain permissions in order to be accessed | 17:17 |
| andres | i mean, that everything is defined in zcml and not retrieved for example out of a sql database. | 17:18 |
| SteveA | to see if the current user has a given permission, the security authorization policy looks to see what the current principal is (the current logged in user), and asks what grants that principal has. | 17:18 |
| SteveA | it is not common to want to deal with 15000 objects all at once with zope3. so, i expect you can do some special things with your design or security to make the security better for your particular case. For example, perhaps you can render this 15000 objects page based not on the "real" objects, but instead on stub objects with zope.Public security | 17:21 |
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| andres | SteveA, well, i will have to do something... Then problem is that i have to check if people have access to certain objects, but as security should be in the sql database anyway (or better said, is, but just ignored for now) i will do it directly i think. | 17:25 |
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| andres | with directly i mean in the query. | 17:28 |
| andres | For now i will just remove the Security Proxy. | 17:28 |
| andres | Stupid Question: After removing a proxy from a container no object out of that container is in a proxy. How can i put them into a Proxy again/How to i get the checker for that? | 17:37 |
| J1m | zope.security.checker.ProxyFactory(ob) | 17:40 |
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| andres | j-w, thanks. | 17:41 |
| andres | J1m, i mean. | 17:41 |
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| MacYET | happy new year | 18:48 |
| benji | Happy New Year to you too, MacYET | 18:50 |
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