IRC log of #zope3-dev for Monday, 2006-01-23

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einsmorning romanofski :)09:50
romanofskihey eins :)09:51
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stubzope.configuration.config.ConfigurationExecutionError: exceptions.AttributeError: 'GlobalSiteManager' object has no attribute 'Adapters'16:07
stubThat sound familiar to anyone? Migrating a customized Zope 3.0 system to 3.216:08
srichterwell, it should be lowercas adapters16:08
srichtercan you give me the last entry of the traceback stack?16:08
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stubHmm... I spy some upper cased Adapters in our code, although I can't see how they would trigger ZCML errors16:45
* stub has a closer look16:45
srichterare you defining your own defaultView directive?16:51
stubYer - I think I've found it now. Cargo culted code, and the original has now changed.16:51
stubHuh... looks like our customization was pushed to Zope 3.2 anyway. Might as well rip that out then..16:55
* stub moves onto the next exception16:58
* efge likes the concept of "cargo culted" code :)16:59
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GaryPosterefge: Hey.  I want to point someone to the Zope 3 LDAP PAU work.  Jim said that you had written most of the pertinent code; that it was broken because of some PAU refactorings; and that the breakage might be shallow.  In the repo I see ldapadapter, ldapauth, and ldappas projects.  To what should I point?  Do they projects interact in some way?17:07
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srichterGaryPoster: ldapadpter and ldapauth should be working17:11
GaryPostersrichter, oh, ok cool.  And they are PAU plugins?17:11
srichterGaryPoster: I fixed those back in June or July to work with the latest auth code; it might have been broken since then, but I doubt it17:12
srichterthere are unittests, so just see whether they pass17:12
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GaryPostersrichter: OK, will do, thanks.  Save me one other bit, if you don't mind :-) .  Does one rely on the other?17:13
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srichterI also have a nice real source test setup, which I need to get released17:13
GaryPosteroh, cool17:13
srichteryes, ldapauth depends on ldapadapter17:13
GaryPosterok, cool.  Thanks, srichter!17:13
srichterldapadapter defines an API similar to RDB Adapter17:13
srichterldapauth uses that API to make its querries17:13
GaryPosterAh, ok, cool17:14
srichtermuch like sqlauth uses RDB adapters17:14
GaryPosterSuddenly I have to run, but will be back in an hour or two17:14
GaryPosterThanks again17:14
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stubCan someone confirm that IPublicationRequestFactory in zope/app/publication/ is broken? The default implementation in zope/app/publication/ has different arguments to the __call__ method17:16
stubOhh... its a backwards compatibility hack17:17
efgeGaryPoster: yo17:23
efgesrichter: hi too :)17:23
efgeGaryPoster: srichter refactored that code last. I think the modules are ldappas and ldapadapter. ldapauth is a previous ldap auth module someone wrote, which is not for PAU17:24
efgemaybe I have switched the names around in my head17:24
srichtererr, I thought ldappas was the old one17:28
srichterlet me check17:28
srichterGaryPoster: efge is right, the ldappas package is what you want17:28
efgeand it should be renamed to ldappau :)17:30
srichteror even better, remove ldapauth and rename ldappas to ldapauth17:31
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faassenJ1m: your proposal was indeed very arcane. Just read my reply to yours, ignore my arguing for ZCML the language. :)19:36
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* philiKON replying to faassen right now :)19:43
efgeman, it's that time of the day again when suddenly 30 messages appear in
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philiKONthat "america has woken up" time :)19:51
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faassenphiliKON: what're you replying to? if for my argument for ZCMl the language, then give it up, I don't need to argue it anymore. :)19:53
philiKONfaassen, you stopped liking ZCML?19:55
philiKONanyways, sent now19:55
faassenphiliKON: what do you mean, I stopped liking ZCML?19:55
philiKONi couldn't really parse that sentence above19:56
faassenphiliKON: I misunderstood Jim's proposal.19:56
faassenphiliKON: so I argued for ZCML19:56
faassenphiliKON: but Jim's proposal isn't really about replacing ZCML with ZConfig syntax.19:56
philiKONit's about alternate zconfig syntaxes19:56
faassenphiliKON: as far as I understand now. isntead it's to use the ZCML engine to implement ZConfig19:56
philiKONalternate syntaxes19:56
faassenphiliKON: to allow extensibility ala ZCML for Zconfig.19:56
philiKONthat's just one part of it19:56
faassenphiliKON: this is as far as I understand it now.19:56
philiKON"Some people feel that using XML for configuration is too cumbersome. They would like to use different formats. "19:57
faassenphiliKON: yeah, anyway, I don't really know what his proposal is anymore.19:57
faassenphiliKON: that is what triggered me.19:57
philiKON"As a format, ZConfig has been very popular. It is less intimidating that ZCML"19:57
philiKONI'm pretty sure it's about providing an alternate syntax for zope.configuration19:57
philiKONZCML being the original one, ZConfig being a new one19:58
faassenanyway, I think ZCML syntax isn't the main problem. ZCML semantics is another discussion.19:59
philiKONbut i agree, the proposal itself is a bit weird. i don't even understand half of the technical stuff there... the -C and -X options, the SAX events, etc....19:59
philiKONi agree19:59
philiKONanyways, going to bed19:59
faassenI think there are problems with that. And it's true that XML is intimidating for many Python programmers, but replacing it with another configuration format won't help. anything else than Python will be intimidating to them.19:59
faassenphiliKON: see you!19:59
philiKONfaassen, good point19:59
srichterI think all what Jim is proposing is that he would like to use ZCML to extend ZConfig20:00
srichterbasically meta directives for ZConfig20:00
philiKONthen 99% of zope3-dev posters are misreading the proposal20:01
philiKONincluding myself20:01
srichterhe has explained this idea to me beofre, so I know, though I agree the wording was very confusing to me as well20:01
philiKONwhich is jsut as well a point for having it improved20:01
philiKONsrichter, i still think the proposal is about having an alternate configuration format for configuring components20:02
philiKONat least that's what everything in the wording is suggesting20:02
srichterok, I am pretty sure it is not, but let's have Jim clarify that :-)20:03
* philiKON rereads20:03
efgewhat'd be nicer for admins is a INI-style format for the zope.configuration engine...20:03
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philiKONsrichter, hmmm. you know what, if i put a lot of imaginary explanatory sentences in there, you might be right20:04
philiKONthough that will basically mean ZConfig will use zope.configuration as a backend20:05
philiKONand that will mean you'll be able to use ZConfig for component confiugration :)20:05
faassenright, once Jim said, huh, what, geez, I'm not proposing that.20:05
faassenin a reply to me.20:05
faassenI think he means something else.20:06
srichterfaassen: yeah, I think your latest mail gets it right20:06
* philiKON just read it20:06
* philiKON recommends to J1m to make the proposal much clearer20:06
philiKONit got like 90% of the people on zope3-dev very confused and started a zcml flame war :)20:07
philiKONyet another i should add ;)20:07
srichterbasically, the extension mechanism for ZConfig is very complex right now adn is a lot of code20:07
philiKONright, i see20:07
J1mIt's amazing that nearly everyone who read the proposal seems to have completely missed the intent.20:07
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* philiKON really goes to bed20:11
philiKONJ1m, the title already threw many people off track, i bet20:12
philiKONthen the usage of words like "intimidating" and "cumbersome" wrt ZCML/XML did the rest :)20:12
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efgealso people quickly mixed the proposal with one of its direct consequences which is that you could then express zope.conf in XML easily20:13
faassenefge: or .zcml files in zconfig? :)20:14
efgefaassen: that too...20:15
efgefor masochists20:15
efgeand xml-haters :)20:16
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efgeJ1m: ayt?21:14
efgeJ1m: did you find about the trace logger?21:14
J1mFraid so21:14
J1mwhat a mess21:14
efgeit's the one that outputs B/I/E/O stuff during publishing21:15
J1mand it dow goes through the loging package21:15
J1mIt wasn't slow enough before I guess21:15
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mcdonci did it. sorry. :-(21:18
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GaryPosterefge: hours later, thank you for the LDAP info. :-)23:57

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