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| romanofski | moin | 09:34 |
|---|---|---|
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| d2m | http://www.springer.com/east/home?SGWID=5-102-22-173705712-0 -- looks like they are shipping since yesterday | 09:44 |
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| philiKON | d2m: ah, nice to know | 11:03 |
| philiKON | thanks ;) | 11:03 |
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| faassen | hey J1m | 15:07 |
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| ignas | faassen: do you know if zc.table sort is preserving the order of the elements being sorted ? I mean if i'll pass a list of objects sorted by their let's say name, and sort the table by group, will people with the same group still be sorted by their name? | 15:18 |
| faassen | ignas: I wouldn't know off the top of my head, but I believe that zc.table has something concerning multiple sort columns that does do that. don't know whether it preserves the order of what comes in after sorting. I would guess that would depend on the behavior of python's sort, which I think is stable after python 2.4 | 15:21 |
| ignas | is see, thank you | 15:22 |
| faassen | or perhaps even python 2.3 | 15:22 |
| faassen | don't know, but Tim Peters made it stable at some point. :) | 15:22 |
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| ignas | is the order of subscribers defined anywhere, or you can't rely on subscribers being called in some particular order? | 18:56 |
| ignas | like - the order they were registered in zcml | 18:56 |
| mgedmin | it is a very very very good idea to not rely on any particular order | 18:57 |
| ignas | just like i though, thank you | 18:57 |
| mgedmin | s/though/thought/? | 18:57 |
| ignas | i have typed too many extra t's today already so i am saving on them now ;) | 18:58 |
| ignas | faassen: ayt ? | 18:58 |
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| faassen | ignas: yup. | 19:00 |
| ignas | faassen: do you remember the local utility thing you did to make overriding person factory possible? | 19:00 |
| faassen | yes. | 19:00 |
| faassen | any problem with it? | 19:01 |
| ignas | ignas: maybe you could tell me how it should be used, as i kind of need a custom person factory, yet as it is a subscriber creating a utility ... | 19:01 |
| ignas | s/ignas/faassen/ | 19:01 |
| faassen | let me look at the code for a minute. | 19:01 |
| faassen | looking it up. | 19:02 |
| ignas | even if i'll add one more subscriber with "override=true" I still won't be sure whether my factory or the demographics.person factory was used | 19:02 |
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| faassen | ah, because of subscriber order? | 19:04 |
| ignas | yes | 19:04 |
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| mgedmin | surely you meant to say "I have yped oo many exra t's oday already so I am saving on hem now"? | 19:05 |
| ignas | no ha many! | 19:06 |
| faassen | ignas: ack, so I guess the current use of override only works by accident. | 19:06 |
| ignas | no, not by accident, it works because the default person factory sets override to False for itself, and there is only 1 other person factory | 19:07 |
| faassen | ignas: well, if that were called *before* the one, is there anything preventing it except the accident? | 19:07 |
| ignas | yes, if you set override to False, and there already is another utility - you just skip the registration step | 19:08 |
| ignas | schooltool/src/schooltool/utility/utility.py:62 | 19:08 |
| faassen | yes but is there anything preventing the override=True event to be called *after* the original event that sets up the original/ | 19:09 |
| * ignas confused | 19:09 | |
| faassen | in the core of schooltool, there are 2 events setting up the person factory utility. | 19:09 |
| ignas | yes | 19:10 |
| faassen | aah, right. | 19:10 |
| faassen | if the order were reversed, the first one wouldn't override the second one. | 19:10 |
| faassen | okay, then at least I wasn't that stupid. :) | 19:10 |
| ignas | you can always admit that you did that intentionally :) | 19:11 |
| faassen | I figure I did think of that then. | 19:11 |
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| faassen | but I'm not sure. :) | 19:11 |
| faassen | anyway, the whole story of that extendability of course doesn't work after you try extending it once or twice.. | 19:12 |
| faassen | there are a number of ways you could go around this. | 19:12 |
| ignas | i know, i'll add override2 :D | 19:13 |
| ignas | that should keep it working | 19:13 |
| faassen | no, in your extension, you could make it hand-triggered. | 19:13 |
| faassen | I mean, imagine you have schooltool. | 19:13 |
| faassen | and you have installed a whole bundle of demographics packages. | 19:13 |
| faassen | one for US, one for NL, etc. | 19:13 |
| faassen | then it's up to you to determine which one you want. | 19:13 |
| faassen | it cannot be done automatically by the events. | 19:13 |
| faassen | though perhaps the scenario would be simply not to hook up their zcml. | 19:14 |
| faassen | hm. | 19:14 |
| faassen | anyway, one way you could do is by installing them all, and having a button somewhere to install the right one. | 19:14 |
| ignas | hmm | 19:14 |
| faassen | that would trigger the utility registration. | 19:14 |
| faassen | so when you install schooltool, it would ask 'which demographics do you want to use' and gives you a list. | 19:14 |
| faassen | and you select the one. | 19:14 |
| faassen | that is, that would happen after the schooltool root already exists. | 19:15 |
| faassen | that's one way to do this kind of things. it makes for a nice installation user interface and configuration in the ZODB there. | 19:15 |
| faassen | the alternative is only to hook up the events you want. | 19:15 |
| faassen | right now the schooltool core is installing the person factory. | 19:15 |
| faassen | in demographics. | 19:15 |
| faassen | perhaps it shouldn't be doing this. instead, that bit should move to an extension. | 19:15 |
| faassen | which you can then hook up with ZCML or not, what you want. | 19:15 |
| faassen | in your alternative extension you'd hook up your own event. | 19:16 |
| faassen | since they'd only be overriding the core, the current behavior would work. | 19:16 |
| faassen | so did you comprehend the two scenarios I sketched? one UI, one event based. | 19:16 |
| ignas | as for the UI based - the problem is that on debian questions are asked before ZODB even exists, before Zope CA gets set up too ... so i can't get a list of registered PersonFactories in there yet ... | 19:20 |
| ignas | i would like to either use ZCML directly for that ... i mean like you set the exact factory only once in some top level zcml file ... | 19:20 |
| faassen | yes. | 19:21 |
| faassen | that's the second scenario. | 19:21 |
| faassen | you'd split out the subscribers currently in the core into their own extension package. | 19:21 |
| faassen | and you'd not install this package and instead hook up your own. | 19:21 |
| ignas | well, i dpn't need any subscribers - i'd make them identical utilities and you'd register only one of them | 19:22 |
| ignas | or named utilities, and you'd only set the name of the one you need ... | 19:22 |
| faassen | oh, you could make them global utilities too. | 19:22 |
| faassen | I don't know what you mean with identical utilities. | 19:22 |
| faassen | but yeah, you could make this a global utility instead. the utility/subscriber stuff makes more sense for the catalog installation which has to be local. | 19:22 |
| ignas | i mean - factories in python code, but not register them in zcml | 19:22 |
| faassen | actually if you made them global utilities you can probably also make it work with ZCML overrides. | 19:23 |
| ignas | probably yes ... | 19:23 |
| ignas | i'll see which way it works out best | 19:23 |
| faassen | I used the same pattern for this one, making it local. | 19:23 |
| faassen | but this factory can of course be global just fine. | 19:23 |
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| faassen | especially if you don't have ZODB-based configuration. | 19:24 |
| faassen | I could imagine after first logging into schooltool it'd ask you various things. | 19:24 |
| faassen | I thikn that would work with debian, it's you're not using debian's configuration machinery. | 19:24 |
| faassen | the advantage would be it'd work outside debian too. :) | 19:24 |
| faassen | the advantage of local subscribers for the factory is that you could have multiple schooltool roots installed into one zope 3 with different demographics setups. since you don't do this with schooltool (though I heard you might want to one day), it might not matter. | 19:25 |
| faassen | I mean, the advantage of local factories (installed by the subscribers) | 19:25 |
| ignas | i know | 19:26 |
| ignas | with multiple schools in the same immage this would be better left to some UI for adding a new school object though ... | 19:26 |
| faassen | yes. | 19:26 |
| faassen | possibly. | 19:26 |
| faassen | probably. :) | 19:26 |
| faassen | the subscribers are useful for utilities that are more or less plumbing, like the intids. | 19:27 |
| faassen | for the catalog indexes and the factory, it's more configuration-driven what happens. | 19:27 |
| faassen | and that'd make more sense in some kind of setup screen somewhere, not with subscribers. | 19:27 |
| faassen | anyway, this is why they say pluggable APIs don't work unless you write a couple of example plugins first. :) | 19:28 |
| faassen | we were veering back and forth on whether this needed to be pluggable or not back then. | 19:29 |
| ignas | indeed | 19:29 |
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| ignas | faassen: one more question, it seems that in the transaction in which schooltool application is created and "notify(ObjectAddedEvent(app))" is signalled, person factory utility is not available yet ... | 19:39 |
| ignas | maybe you know why ? | 19:39 |
| faassen | ignas: possibly because your site is set up correctly yet? | 19:43 |
| faassen | ignas: I mean, isn't set up correctly yet. | 19:43 |
| faassen | ignas: otherwise I wouldn't know. | 19:43 |
| ignas | i see | 19:43 |
| faassen | ignas: but you could try doing an experimental getSite() in the code where it isn't there yet. | 19:43 |
| faassen | ignas: and see what you get. | 19:43 |
| ignas | it makes Manager user the single one user that is not indexed by the catalog :) | 19:44 |
| faassen | hm. | 19:44 |
| ignas | superman is invisible to your Catalog rays | 19:44 |
| ignas | :) | 19:44 |
| * faassen grins. | 19:44 | |
| faassen | I remember having to struggle somewhat with schooltool's special setup procedure. | 19:44 |
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| faassen | anyway, I hope you can use sitonite to weaken superman. :) | 19:45 |
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| ignas | faassen: found the problem, the site is not set in there so i must do it manually around the place where the manager user is created (like the code that set's up utilities does) | 19:54 |
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| ignas | faassen: thanks for the tech support :) | 20:06 |
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| faassen | ignas: no problem. | 20:18 |
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