IRC log of #zope3-dev for Wednesday, 2008-01-16

ronnyi just want to figure how good indexing is - i'd like to do stuff like taging objects, and do fast queries on larger collections of those tagged objects00:01
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ronnyi just have no idea how to get a fit index, and how to search the objects using it00:01
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nerdalerthello, I'm having a little page template trouble where my DOCTYPE declaration isn't being propagated to the rendered output.  I've done some digging for a solution, but still haven't found one.  has anyone here had to deal with a similar problem before?00:32
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goschtlHi, first sorry for asking in this channel but i don´t know if it´s a Z3 or grok thing. I got in an grok.AddForm an ContentProviderLookupError for my viewlets. Here is the method and error_log -->
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afd_goschtl: there's a #grok channel, they might be able to help you14:41
afd_I'd say check if your content provider is registered, but I don't know grok14:42
goschtlafd_: i ve already asked there but no solution so far. and i use pure Z3 viewlets.14:43
afd_goschtl: did you register it for your layer?14:43
goschtlafd_: i dont use a special layer. look here this is my config  --> And the viewlets work in a normal grok.View14:45
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SteveAdoes trunk Zope 3 work with python 2.5 now?15:59
timteI think it should, but perhaps it's not official yet.16:00
benji_I suspect not; there was a status page somewhere (I think a reference to it was made on the mailing list in the last couple of days)16:05
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timteFrom the zope3 faq16:10
timteCurrently (for Zope 3.3 and 3.4) Python 2.4 is required, Python 2.5 is not supported yet. Even though Python 2.5 is not supported, you can run Zope 3 packages using Python 2.5. Python 2.5 will be officially supported when Zope 2 also run under that version.16:10
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philiKON_SteveA: theoretically yes17:46
philiKON_SteveA: but there are problems on 64 bit linux machines17:46
philiKON_that haven't been dealt with iirc17:46
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xkennethHey all, quick question, where can i find documentation on the template macros?17:52
xkennethLike this: <html metal:use-macro="context/@@standard_macros/view">17:53
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mgedminwhat's that?18:06
xkennetham i missing something completely obvious?18:06
mgedminlike that zope 3 documentation is in a sorry state? ;-)18:07
mgedminwhat exactly do you want to know -- about the metal: namespace in page templates, about @@standard_macros, or about what macros are provided by default?18:07
philiKON_mgedmin: or that there's a whole book on zope 3 that people frequently ignore when talking about z3 docs18:11
mgedmintwo books even18:11
mgedminaltough the other one might be outdated18:11
mgedminbut it's not online, so I can't google and post a URL here :/18:12
* benji glances over at the ever-handy copy of one of those books.18:12
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* mgedmin looks longingly at the company amazon wishlist that nobody ever gets around to actually ordering...18:12
xkennethinstead of using the macro to have the entire zmi interface at the top, i'd just like to have the ability to log in and then display my object18:14
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xkennethis there any sort of way to debug with zope? other than the eternally long error messages/18:23
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benjixkenneth: pretty much any debugging tools you can use for Python work for Zope18:24
benjiI'm partial to import pdb;pdb.set_trace() ;)18:24
mgedminseeing that no one answered your macro question18:25
mgedminI'll try18:25
mgedminI don't use @@standard_macros18:25
mgedminI create a custom set of macros for my applications18:25
mgedminand use those in my application object views18:25
mgedminit's easy: create a, register it as a view in zcml, then start using it like context/@@my_macros/macroname18:26
xkennethi'll give it a try18:26
xkennethso, i've set up a basic zope product, but it causes system errors when i try to access the page views, how can i debug this?18:27
xkennethi can add the product without errors18:27
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mgedminlook at the traceback18:31
mgedminyou'll see it on the terminal where you started z318:31
xkennethbut it's really long18:31
mgedminand also via the 'Errors' menu item in the ZMI18:31
mgedminah, well, tracebacks that happen when you render page templates are sadly long and confusing18:31
mgedminthe ZMI error views show you the name of the page template and the TALES expression in it18:31
mgedminwhich is very useful18:32
mgedminand which you don't see in standard python tracebacks18:32
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xkennethstill can't quite find anything of use18:36
xkennethit looks like something i'm doing is causing an error deep in zope, and i can't trace it back to an error in my code18:36
xkennethwhat does pdb do?18:37
mgedminpastebin the traceback here18:38
xkennethohh, breakpoints18:39
mgedminmaybe we'll spot it18:39
xkennethit's big18:39
mgedminthat's what pastebins are for18:39
mgedminsee /topic18:39
lisppaste6xkenneth pasted "Zope Error" at
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mgedminokay, this is interesting18:43
xkennethyes indeed18:43
xkennethlike i said, not alot of help18:43
xkennethit was working18:43
mgedminI'd say it's a bug in
xkennethah ok..18:44
xkennethwell i just followed the hello world tut18:44
mgedminit found a menu item it didn't expect18:44
xkennethand started renaming things18:44
mgedminifaces.index(...) hmmm18:44
mgedminI'd like to see what item_for is18:44
mgedminand what's ifaces18:44
mgedmindid you register your view on a class or on an interface?18:44
xkennethi don't know?18:44
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xkennethit's a product18:45
xkennethand i use a "slug" to load it18:45
mgedmindid you write it yourself?18:46
xkennethfollowing the tutorial..18:47
mgedminwell then18:48
mgedminit means you wrote some zcml18:48
mgedminthat has either <browser:menuItem> or <browser:page menu="..." title="...">18:49
mgedminand I was wondering whether these directives had for=".interfaces.IYourInterfaceName" or for=".implementation.YourClassName"18:49
SteveAthanks philiKON_18:49
xkennethactually it has18:50
lisppaste6xkenneth pasted "My configure.zcml" at
SteveAphiliKON_: who is able to fix the problems with zope3 on python2.5 on 64 bit linux?  and is this something that some funded development would help with?18:50
xkenneththat help?18:53
mgedminxkenneth: it doesn't disprove my theory18:53
mgedminI was just looking for zope 3 bugs about menu items breaking down when they are registered for a class rather than for an interface18:53
mgedminI didn't find any18:53
xkennethi really appreciate all of your help18:54
mgedminmaybe you're the first to find it :-)18:54
xkennethi always break stuff18:54
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mgedminhm it seems to have been fixed in rev 7903518:55
mgedminyep, it was a bug, and it's fixed in a newer zope 3 version18:55
xkennethoh ok18:55
mgedminas a workaround, you can refrain from registering menu items for classes18:56
mgedminand use interfaces like the rest of us18:56
xkennethany docs?18:56
mgedminyou mentioned a tutorial18:56
mgedminwhat tutorial?18:56
mgedmindoesn't it describe interfaces?18:57
xkennethoh no18:57
xkennethi'm using an interface18:57
xkennethperhaps i'm just registering it incorrectly with zope18:58
mgedminso there's an IMWDCommander then?18:58
xkennethsorry, still a newbie here18:59
xkennethyou can view the source if you like18:59
mgedmingo through your zcml and replace for=".MWDCommander.MWDCommander" with for=".whereveryouputit.IMWDCommander"18:59
mgedminignore the addMenuItem, it's not the one that broke18:59
mgedminjust the two <browser:page> directives18:59
mgedminthat should fix it18:59
xkennethyes it did19:01
xkennethi really appreciate your help19:02
xkennethare you a developer?19:02
xkennethmind if i ask another question?19:03
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mgedmindon't ask to ask, just ask19:04
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xkennethah k19:05
xkennethso is there any way to view the macro defined by the statement "<html metal:use-macro="context/@@standard_macros/view">" so that i can write my own? or is that some sort of default statement that's understood by zope?19:06
mgedminlook at src/zope/app/rotterdam/view_macros.pt19:08
philiKON_SteveA: sorry, no idea19:08
srichterJ1m: Theuni: ZODB 3.8.0 final time?19:08
srichterTheuni: do you have any objections to the final version?19:08
mgedminthere's a StandardMacros view somewhere that does some magic remapping of 'view' to 'page' for backwards compatibility, if I'm not mistaken19:08
srichterJ1m: I noticed that ZODB 3.8.0c1 did not include registerDB.test, so some tests are failing because of that19:09
srichterJ1m: this file will be included, if you use setuptools, but with plain old distutils I could not make it be included19:09
mgedminphiliKON_: any details about those python2.5 problems and 64-bit systems?19:10
mgedmindo any of the problems also apply to python2.4 on 64-bit systems?19:10
philiKON_iirc, they're btree related19:10
philiKON_there's an issue on launchpad19:10
* mgedmin searches19:11
SteveAhmm... I don't think we use btrees in lp19:11
* philiKON_ can't find anything19:11
mgedmin"64" is a bad keyword for searching :)19:11
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philiKON_mgedmin, SteveA:
philiKON_seems like it was fixed19:17
mgedminhm, it doesn't mention python versions much19:20
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Theunisrichter: IMHO go ahead.19:24
Theunisrichter: oh wait.19:24
Theunithere's a blob test failing on windows19:24
Theunithat's in as high priority19:24
Theunithe clientstorage bug isn't that important for me in 3.8, it's more relevant for 3.919:25
bigkevmcdAnybody had a chance to look at ?19:25
Theunieverything else is not a showstopper19:25
mgedminmmm, fast machines19:31
mgedmin  Ran 654 tests with 0 failures and 0 errors in 41.275 seconds.19:31
mgedmin(zodb tests from zope 3.2 on python2.4 on a 64-bit machine)19:31
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suptondumb question (purely out of curiosity): is there a reason why the zope.annotation egg in pypi depends on 73 other packages (including a bunch of* packages)?  (Not that I'm advocating use of cheeseshop for production applications!)19:46
srichterTheuni: is this bug reported?19:46
srichtersupton: it is historical; there are some dependencies that we have to unscrew to make this sane19:47
srichtersupton: btw, using the cheeseshop in combination with the Zope 3.4 KGS is okay for production :-)19:47
suptonsrichter: thanks, thought as much.19:47
xkennethdoes Zope generally have a hard time with safari?19:48
* supton is using zope.schema, zope.component, zope.interface in a non-web, non-ZODB CA framework - trying to keep dependencies low.19:48
mgedminunraveling historical dependencies is a noble goal19:49
srichtersupton: that's cool19:54
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xkennethcan I access an object inside of zope? IE i created my class, gave it an interface, and registered the interface, and I can add it/use it from within zope, but is there any way i could get into the data stored inside that class from an external python process? perhaps by connecting to zope's instance of the ZODB as a zeo client?20:11
suptonxkenneth: try getting comfortable exploring in zopectl debug, then write a script you run with zopectl run.  You have the right idea on how this might work: you would likely want to set up another zeo client just for running scripts.20:20
xkennethis it ok to talk in main?20:20
J1mTheuni, does that mean that 3.8 is ready to go? Or not?20:21
J1msrichter, I have no time/desire to debug the non-setuptools installation wrt the test file.20:21
J1m3.9 is going to require setuptools. :)20:21
J1mMuch of the complexity in the ZODB setup file is to overcome limitations in distutils that setuptools addresses. afaik20:22
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mgedminsupton: yeah, zopectl debug (aka bin/debugzope) is good20:30
mgedminthat was supposed to be directed to xkenneth20:30
xkenneththat wasn't quite what i was getting at20:31
xkennethlet me explain my situation20:31
xkennethi've got an external python process, that does alot of daq20:31
xkennethi make lots of calculation on this data etc, graphs, text, blah20:31
xkennethand i want all of this to be displayed via the web by zope20:32
xkennethand i really like zodb for storing data as opposed to a traditional row/column relational database20:32
xkennethso i was going to do one of two things20:32
xkennethstart an external zeo process20:32
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xkennethand have my external python process, populate it with data, and have my zope product simply read the data and display20:33
xkennethor if i can, it would be nice to find some way to connect to my zope instance as a zeo client20:33
xkennethand populate perhaps an array or something, which is an attribute of one instance of my product, and let the ZODB that zope is running off of handle all of the storage20:34
xkennethi hope i'm being clear with all of this..20:34
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mgedminyou can do that with zeo, yes20:37
xkennethwell i guess my question was can i connect to my zope instances db as a zeo client?20:38
xkennethsorry this isn't really zope3 dev related....20:39
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mgedminas usual I don't know where this is documented20:42
mgedminbut I know how to find examples in the source tree ;)20:42
mgedminyou'll need to import ZODB.DB and create a ZODB.DB.DB() instance20:42
mgedminpassing a storage to it20:42
mgedminand that storage will be ZEOClientStorage or some such20:42
xkenneththanks again20:44
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J1mTheuni, do you know how to add someone to a launchpad project?21:34
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J1mI think I figured it out.21:38
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xkennethfairly quiet room23:50
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xkennethis there a good bit of documentation on macros?23:55
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benjithe METAL spec is at
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