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| paule118 | fuck off | 00:13 |
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| tuxella | hello everybody | 02:10 |
| tuxella | is there another way of installing zope3 under OpenBSD than by hand ? | 02:11 |
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| pcardune | tuxella: maybe with eggs? | 02:20 |
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| afd_ | I'm trying to evolve an Persistent object to be a BTreeContainer, is there some example out there or I should figure out by myself? | 11:53 |
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| jodok | srichter: ping | 12:10 |
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| tarek | hi, what is the best way to override an existing meta:directive (in its namespace) ? | 13:29 |
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| tarek | hi, what is the best way to override an existing meta:directive (in its namespace) ? | 13:51 |
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| pyqwer | afd_: What do you mean by "evolve Persistent -> BTreeContainer"? You mean you have objects in your database that you need to migrate? | 14:46 |
| afd_ | pyqwer: I've solved the issue... | 14:47 |
| pyqwer | Ok... | 14:47 |
| afd_ | obj._SampleContainer__data = OOBTree() | 14:47 |
| afd_ | :) | 14:47 |
| pyqwer | Ah ok, quite simple. | 14:47 |
| pyqwer | What's particulary interesting here is how you can now add/delete objects from this object. | 14:48 |
| afd_ | pyqwer: did you solve the problem with your proxies? | 14:48 |
| pyqwer | obj['mykey'] should work, but del obj['mykey'] does not. | 14:48 |
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| pyqwer | afd_: Well, I solved parts of it, I sent a mail to the zope-users list yesterday. | 14:50 |
| afd_ | I'm not particularly concerned about that migration... it was for a test site I was doing, I didn't want to throw away the test objects (and my sampledata generation was a bit left behind) | 14:50 |
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| pyqwer | It seems, that z3c.layer is somehow broken in a way that if I define/use a Layer/Skin that inherits from IPageletBrowserLayer context objects are not proxied. | 14:50 |
| pyqwer | But that seems to be not always the case, because I have another application that is very, very similar and it works there. | 14:51 |
| afd_ | weird | 14:52 |
| pyqwer | Anyway, this is very bad as the application continues to work, but with all proxies disabled, so there's no security then. | 14:52 |
| pyqwer | So, no problem for my development system, but this has to be fixed for the production system. | 14:52 |
| pyqwer | Views are, however, protected. I digged into the zope3 source code but got stuck at the implementation of queryMultiAdapter() which seems to remove the proxy. | 14:53 |
| pyqwer | There's some "magic" going on there which I don't understand, maybe parts of that are implemented in C. | 14:54 |
| pyqwer | I'm hoping that someone with more insight will solve that problem. | 14:54 |
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| baijum | Where is the canonical location for Buildout's bootstrap.py ? | 15:47 |
| srichter | baijum: I think it si in the buildout source; | 15:48 |
| benji | svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/zc.buildout/trunk/bootstrap/bootstrap.py | 15:48 |
| baijum | ah, ok | 15:49 |
| pyqwer | srichter: Can you give me a hint how to set the "require" flag to false in z3c.form? (I have an interface with attributes that have require=True but my form should not require input). | 15:50 |
| benji | unsolicited advice: I like to add an external to my projects to the directory above and then symlink bootstrap.py to bootstrap/bootstrap.py in the project, that way I always have the latest version, but it also appears in the "normal" location in the project | 15:50 |
| srichter | pyqwer: let me check the API :-) | 15:50 |
| srichter | pyqwer: but it should be something like this: fields['name'].required = False | 15:50 |
| pyqwer | Yes, thought so, in the update() method, I have something like for key, field in fields.items(): field.required=False | 15:51 |
| pyqwer | But it does not work. | 15:51 |
| srichter | let me check | 15:52 |
| baijum | benji, what about putting that file in a downloadable location ? so that users can just use: wget ? | 15:52 |
| pyqwer | If I do a "for key, widget in self.widgets.items(): widget.required=False", the "*" character is gone but it checks the input nevertheless... | 15:52 |
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| benji | baijum: it is fetchable via wget: http://svn.zope.org/*checkout*/zc.buildout/trunk/bootstrap/bootstrap.py?content-type=text%2Fplain | 15:55 |
| benji | (not the nicest URL in the world, but...) | 15:55 |
| baijum | benji, ah. ok, what about putting it in http://download.zope.org/distribution/ ? | 15:56 |
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| benji | <shrug> I'd rather it be in only one place, the overhead of keeping them synched seems worse than a slightly ugly URL | 15:57 |
| baijum | benji, I started writing a tutorial (a book;)..I found it bit awkward to say to use 'svn' while beginning a new project from a fresh Python.. | 16:00 |
| benji | another option would be to say to install zc.buildout via setuptools, and use it to bootstrap your project | 16:01 |
| benji | something like "svn cat svn://svn.zope.org/.../bootstrap.py | python" doesn't seem too bad either | 16:03 |
| baijum | benji, I am using this option now...but I hear Jim's words about "Sane Python" ... | 16:03 |
| benji | agreed, but you have to know your audiance, if they're just getting started, they're playing around; at the end you can have a section about how you really should build your own clean python and go over some of the gotchas for that (make sure you have zlib development libraries installed, etc.) | 16:05 |
| benji | I have a theory that writing good technical tutorials is about knowing how much to lie to the reader and when to come clean :) | 16:06 |
| pyqwer | benji: No, that's not true, I think - it's about keeping quiet about some things the reader does not yet have to know. | 16:07 |
| benji | lies of omission are still lies ;) | 16:07 |
| baijum | benji, well, I will try both story (one as a side note)...I guess that would be fine for now | 16:08 |
| srichter | benji: yeah, this is a dangerous theory :-) | 16:08 |
| pyqwer | Well, that depends: If the reader urges to know how/why things happen, it's bad if this information is kept from him. | 16:08 |
| srichter | benji: it is very very commonly practiced | 16:08 |
| pyqwer | If not, it's a relief for him. | 16:08 |
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| pyqwer | srichter: Yes, but it's very often a bad practice. | 16:08 |
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| srichter | benji: I do not believe in it, because then you have to unlearn things, which is even harder | 16:09 |
| benji | srichter: you know more about writing technical documents than me, plus I'm evil, so that plays a role ;) | 16:09 |
| srichter | benji: I think this is where sensible defaults int he technology are very important | 16:09 |
| pyqwer | I am quite often confronted with technical documents that give you the impression that you understand things, but in reality you only followed recipes which you don't really understand. This can get very frustrating in the end. | 16:10 |
| srichter | benji: if you have sensible defaults, you do not have to lie, can still have a simple explanation and fill out later | 16:10 |
| pyqwer | srichter: Yes, that's also my opinion. | 16:10 |
| benji | srichter: that's more or less my intent, I just make it sound conniving | 16:10 |
| srichter | benji: in our community, I think this is well demonstrated by both zope.formlib and z3c.form; the defaults are so well-designed (z3c.form copied all that from zope.formlib) that it is really, really easy to write initial documentation for it | 16:11 |
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| pyqwer | srichter: Ah, got the "required" thing: "for key, value in fields.items(): value.field.required=False" | 17:07 |
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| pyqwer | srichter: Hmmm, that's bad - this code permanently alters the Interface... | 17:17 |
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| Theuni | benji: cool thing | 20:32 |
| benji | Theuni: I think so. ;) | 20:38 |
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| Theuni | :) | 21:32 |
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| Jonny | wonders where i manage to step in now | 22:30 |
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| jonny234 | 1...this room is dead... | 22:33 |
| jonny234 | 2...i might do somthing wrong... | 22:33 |
| jonny234 | 3.....a combo of both | 22:33 |
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| Theuni | I'd say 20% 1) and 80% 2) | 22:37 |
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| Theuni | so yes, 3) | 22:43 |
| Theuni | at least at this time | 22:43 |
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