IRC log of #zope for Thursday, 2011-04-14

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koshhail freaks!02:15
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CIA-83davisagli * r121420 persistent/persistent/tests/ ( moving to avoid name collision on case-insensitive fs :-[07:32
CIA-83davisagli * r121421 persistent/ (buildout.cfg include all test dependencies07:32
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CIA-83davisagli * r121422 persistent/persistent/ fix spelling08:38
CIA-83davisagli * r121423 persistent/persistent/ ( tests/ add missing __repr__ to Python TimeStamp08:38
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CIA-83icemac * r121424 ( buildout.cfg): added + fixed URL of versions.cfg09:47
CIA-83icemac * r121425 (8 files in 3 dirs): Conform to repository policy.09:47
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CIA-83icemac * r121426 zc.set/ ( buildout.cfg CHANGES.txt):10:33
CIA-83- Added test extra to declare test dependency on ``zope.testing``.10:33
CIA-83- Added change log to tell that the packackes seems not to be compatible with Python 2.6+10:33
CIA-83icemac * r121427 zc.set/ (LICENSE.txt COPYRIGHT.txt): Conform to repository policy.10:33
betabughmmm, doesn't Zope 2.13 have CatalogPathAware any more?10:34
betabugtrying this old app on 2.13 and it says ImportError: cannot import name CatalogPathAware10:34
betabughmmm, according to the code it's deprecated, but not yet removed10:38
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vaninwagencan anyone help me with this bug in zopeproject: Error: There is a version conflict. We already have: zc.buildout 1.5.2 ?11:31
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betabugvaninwagen: you get that with easy_install?11:41
vaninwagenzopeproject? yes11:42
vaninwageni installed it with distribute/easy_install11:42
betabugdid you use virtualenv?11:43
vaninwagenis this recommended?11:43
vaninwageni used zopeproject-0.4.2-py2.6.egg11:43
betabugso probably the python you are using already has zc.buildout somewhere11:43
betabugwell, to tell you the truth, I don't know or use zopeproject11:44
vaninwagenso, is there an easier way?11:44
betabugbut this kind of thing is exactly what you avoid with virtualenv and --no-site-packages11:44
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betabugso, usually people use easy_install inside virtualenv11:45
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vaninwagenbut why is it a problem to have another buildout somewhere?11:47
betabugif the versions don't match, maybe it's not working fine11:47
vaninwagenok, which version is recommended?11:48
betabugI have no idea11:51
betabugjust install virtualenv11:52
betabugthen create an "empty" environment with that11:52
vaninwagenok, thanks11:52
betabugand use easy_install to install zopeproject there, it will get what it needs11:52
vaninwageni just found it to inconvenient always to switch to the virtualenv11:52
vaninwagenok, i will use virtualenv as a fallback11:52
vaninwagenthanks again :)11:53
betabugwell, maybe someone with more knowledge of zopeproject could tell you more11:53
betabugbut virtualenv is good to separate things11:53
vaninwagenso, did it in virtualenv but getting an error in meta.zcml12:04
vaninwagenis this known behaviour, easy to fix?12:04
betabugno idea, sorry12:09
betabugmaybe put the error on a pastebin ans ask here12:09
betabugsomeone more knowledgeable with this particular thing might wake up12:10
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vaninwagenso, here it is:
vaninwagenwhen invoking :bin/<project_name>-ctl fg12:15
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vaninwagenwithout the colon12:15
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betabughmmm, got my big, old app to run on 2.1312:29
betabugwith some hax0ring12:29
betabughmmmm, how do I run my tests in 2.13??12:32
betabugzopectl has forgotten all knowledge about "test"?12:32
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koshbetabug: no idea about that one13:24
betabughey kosh13:24
betabughow do you run your tests?13:24
koshbetabug: so far I have still not gotten relstorage to run as fast as zeo but it is only a few percent behind most of the time13:25
koshon the plus side though even with 500 simul connections I get no errors and zeo does not handle that, it starts giving conflicterrors even on reads13:25
koshI don't have any real tests13:25
betabugso, relstorage has its uses :-)13:25
koshI don't agree with test driven development13:25
betabugaha, well, I have lots of tests13:25
betabugand now playing around with 2.13, I'd like to run them13:26
koshI run into so few bugs per year that writing tests for so much code seems like a gigantic waste of time13:26
betabugthis unicode migration I'm doing now would be *really* scary without tests13:26
koshhave wget crawl the entire site and check the error log for errors13:27
betabugthat won't turn up all the rats13:28
betabugsince we're talking about how input is handled13:28
betabugso you input something e.g. in screen 2 and won't get an error till you hit screen 413:29
koshah I see13:29
betabugall my current tests pass, but now I'm createing a "walkthrough" with mechbrowser13:29
betabugthat goes through every corner of the UI and plays with all the interfaces13:30
koshusually if I do input testing I write a simple little script to do posting of various things and all my documents use the same form processor so if it works on one it will work on all13:30
betabugyeah, this codebase is not that organized unfortunately13:30
koshactually I have the same form processor for every document on every site with the way I have it setup :)13:31
betabugyeah, that's cool13:31
koshat least for the edit interface stuff, a lot of public viewer facing forms use a different form processing framework13:32
kosheventually I need to unify that13:32
koshI try to make as many things shared as possible13:35
betabugless code is good13:35
koshand whenever I find myself doing the same thing in more then a few sites I try to build it into one of my products13:35
betabugthis app has lots and lots of duplication13:35
koshand then find everyplace that used the old way and rip that way out and use only the new system13:35
koshit makes it so much easier to keep things updated13:35
koshthat is why when I put the version information on my images it fixed it on about 99%+ of cases without any changes on all sites, even ones that have not been updated in 5 years13:36
koshwhich makes every site faster with no manual work13:36
koshI am impressed though with relstorage doign stuff in very very high loads13:37
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koshat 100 concurrency from ab and hitting the same page 100K times I would get about 5 errors with zeo and 0 with relstorage, at 500 concurrency I still get 0 with relstorage and hundreds with zeo and zeo won't really complete 1000 and relstorage handled 1000 on the last test still with no errors13:38
koshbut very slowly at that point13:38
koshright now I am running wget across a site to get profiling data13:39
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teixkosh: interesting! are you using it with MySQL or PosgreSQL?13:54
betabugpostgre IIRC13:54
koshI have been testing with postgres13:56
koshthere is no way I would use mysql13:56
koshusing mysql seems to be exactly like saying I don't care about my data and I love spending time restoring systems13:58
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CIA-83janwijbrand * r121428 megrok.chameleon/ (4 files in 3 dirs):13:59
CIA-83Grok's idea of view template namespaces is put into the 'options' namespace by13:59 This means namespaces like 'viewlet' and 'viewletmanager', but also13:59
CIA-83whatever namespace was set by the view component's namespace() method would not13:59
CIA-83be directly available in the template. This is fixed by updating the template13:59
CIA-83context with Grok's idea of template namespaces. Added a test to demonstrate the13:59
CIA-83janwijbrand * r121429 megrok.chameleon/src/megrok/chameleon/tests/cpt_fixture/app_templates/namespace.cpt: forgot to add the template13:59
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teixkosh: eheh14:09
koshteix: mysql just does not seem reliable in practice, don't know exactly why just that it is not14:11
koshso far in 8 years or so I have not once had to restore a filestorage database14:13
koshbetabug: I just realized that zope.conf can use includes so I have started moving stuff common between my zope.conf into a seperate file14:31
koshbetabug: so now I can just configure all my databases in one file instead of 414:31
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koshbetabug: my script that creates blobs from all the files/images in a db runs at least 10x faster thoug with zeo then with relstorage strangely enough14:52
betabugmaybe the blob support in relstorage is not optimal?14:53
koshbetabug: that script walks the entire db opening every container to find the objects it needs, guess that is a worse case scenario for rel storage though14:53
koshwell the conversion seems to run about the same speed, it is the finding process that is ungodly faster with zeo14:53
betabuggrrrrr, I want to run my tests!!!14:59
koshhmm I went back to zeo and changed a single setting for caching my transient object container and now zeo is maintaining 500 requests concurrently with no errors and 18 req/s compared to relstorage at the same level of 6 req/s15:02
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koshhmm it also looks like with the pure zope + zeo setup I can pure more memory into caching since they take less memory then zope + relstorage + memcache + postgres does15:03
koshI have 4 zopes connected to 3 zeo servers, 1 zeo server for the main db, 1 zeo server for transient stuff and 1 zeo server for persistent session stuff15:05
koshseemed like a good idea to break it up instead of having 1 zeo server serve 3 dbs15:05
koshzeo definitely kicks a lot more ass in zope 2.1315:07
koshand this is just with blobstorage15:07
koshlater I want to test zlibstorage also15:07
koshsupposed to be even faster and better for memory usage15:08
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* betabug installing 2.13 via buildout now, as that's supposed to have a testrunner15:32
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koshI kind of installed mine with buildout15:35
kosh2.13 though is probably one of the biggest changes in zope in a long time, zope 2.x devel seems to be improving15:35
betabugwell, according to docs, virtualenv is the official way15:35
koshheh that was a disaster when I tried to get that working right, autostarting etc15:35
betabugwell, no idea, just wanted to see if it runs without ruining my system python15:37
koshwhen I did the buildout version it did not put anything in the system python15:39
koshwhat it did was make zopectl and zeoctl files that had all the eggs listed that zope uses15:39
koshso nothing was put anywhere other then where I built it15:40
betabugdunno, I now have a buildout inside a virtualenv :-)15:40
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betabughmmm, so buildout and easy_install do not mix15:45
koshI did not use easy_install for anything15:46
betabugwell, SimpleUserFolder wants ZRDB.Result15:46
betabugwhich now lives in Products.ZSQLMethods15:46
betabugwell, adding it to buildout.cfg gave an error, but it worked :-)15:48
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koshbetabug: well your idea better work or I am sending godzilla to wipe out greece16:23
betabugthe result will probably be you looking a few days later and finding godzilla drinking and partying with the greeks16:24
betabugmy ideas are great, but I still can't test my products with the buildout setup16:24
koshmaybe I will send him to japan instead then, they should be expecting him at this point given their major screwup16:24
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koshsee you freaks later16:31
betabughf kosh16:31
* kosh hands sm a crate a grenades and tosses betabug a bunch of pins16:31
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smlater kosh16:36
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betabugtrying my luck again with the zope mailing list16:50
betabug2 mails in 1 day, the listserver will break down16:50
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jeffschuleri've got a corrupted ZODB. [Python 2.5.1 Plone 2.5.5 and I believe Zope3-1.0.] If I restore from a backup is it possible to apply the non-corrupted newer transactions from my corrupted Data.fs to the restored Data.fs?19:09
betabugjeffschuler: I don't think so19:11
betabugjeffschuler: what you would try is to take the corrupted data.fs and "cut" it from the back, till you get it functioning again19:11
jeffschulerbetabug: i believe the corruption came from hardware issues, so my thinking is that the corruption might not be at the end of the file. am i incorrect in this assumption?19:18
betabugno idea19:18
betabugif it's hardware indeed, it might be anywhere19:19
jeffschuleris there a good tool for "cutting" the file from the back?19:19
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betabughmmm, I think there is a procedure, a friend of mine used some while ago, let me ask19:19
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jeffschulerwhen starting zeo, i get a "ERROR ZODB.Connection Couldn't load state for 0x0c2f" -- a BadPickleGet error. is there a way to trace this to the transaction that failed?19:21
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betabugI don't know, in 8 years of zope I never had those problems personally19:21
betabugok, here is what my friend used:
betabugif it's at the end of the DB, your chances are good19:24
betabugif it's really hardware that ate your zodb, it might be tougher19:24
jeffschulerthanks betabug.19:25
betabugwell, good luck :-)19:25
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jeffschuleri truncated Data.fs per betabug's suggestion to no success. I still get a "cPickle.BadPickleGet: 758" error when starting up my zeocluster client... any idea what this points to or how to debug further?20:31
betabugoutch, suxx20:32
jeffschulertesting Data.fs with also ultimately fails with this error20:32
jeffschuleri'm about to try though I imagine it may suffer same consequences20:33
jeffschulerdo you know what this points to? this is an inherited server and I'm new to Zope.20:34
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betabugme I don't know this error20:37
betabugI know that serious damage to data.fs is only happening from hardware problems20:38
betabugwhile most problems are "at the end" of the file, with bad things happening while writing20:38
betabugso most people get off fine with truncating the data.fs20:38
betabugbut all of this is hearsay20:38
jeffschulerpickling is Python's object serialization, right? so BadPickleGet indicates that a binary object in the db was corrupted, and that trying to de-serialize it is failing  hard. can I somehow figure out which object this is happening on, and since Data.fs is an ordered transaction log, fix those transactions using those from a backup?20:42
betabugI think that should be possible, but I'm not the guy to talk to myself :-)20:42
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CIA-83ldr * r121430 z3c.form/src/z3c/form/widget.txt: typos22:49
CIA-83ldr * r121431 z3c.form/src/z3c/form/widget.txt: typos22:49
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