| dman13 | maybe add a week or two if you (srichter) think you'll need more time to finish the fixes you mentioned earlier | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| srichter | I do it as I have time | 00:00 |
| dman13 | sure, I just wouldn't like to see you have the fixes almost done, but have to leave them out on account of needing just a couple more days | 00:02 |
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| bob2 | hm | 06:42 |
| bob2 | reaing the "principal annotations" chapter of srichter's book | 06:43 |
| bob2 | but services are gone in 3.1 | 06:43 |
| bob2 | so I'm a bit confuse about how to register the utility | 06:43 |
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| zagy | moin | 08:31 |
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| philiKON | bob2, why register it. it's already there | 10:37 |
| philiKON | bob2, and it's a local utility | 10:37 |
| bob2 | hmm, ok | 10:49 |
| bob2 | getting rid of services does make everything easier | 10:49 |
| bob2 | as long as you know how it makes it easier ;) | 10:49 |
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| philiKON | :) | 10:51 |
| bob2 | is it likely you or srichter will have a chance to update your books to 3.1 sometime soon? | 10:53 |
| philiKON | i will try to update my book for 3.2 | 11:02 |
| bob2 | ah | 11:03 |
| philiKON | which is due in december | 11:03 |
| philiKON | maybe in the end it'll be 3.3, dunno yet | 11:03 |
| philiKON | releasing stuff onto paper takes time | 11:03 |
| philiKON | but yes, i deifnitely have the plans | 11:03 |
| bob2 | true | 11:03 |
| bob2 | if your book was online... :-) | 11:03 |
| philiKON | then i'd get no money whatsoever | 11:04 |
| philiKON | i'm just a poor college student | 11:04 |
| bob2 | hehe, fair enough | 11:05 |
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| bob2 | so, I've asked a couple of times | 11:23 |
| bob2 | but I still haven't really figured out how to write a form that modifies a bunch of objects | 11:23 |
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| bob2 | hm, tho, I did buy srichter's book, as well as reading it online | 12:34 |
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| benji_york | srichter, AYT? | 17:25 |
| srichter | yes | 17:27 |
| srichter | benji_york: what's up? | 17:27 |
| benji_york | Gary has been writing some testbrowser tests and we've come up with a fairly big change, and I wanted to make sure you didn't have a bunch of tests you'll have to fix | 17:29 |
| srichter | I have a copy of testbrowser in schooltool | 17:29 |
| srichter | so it will not affect me | 17:29 |
| benji_york | oh, ok | 17:29 |
| benji_york | FYI, here's what we're doing... | 17:30 |
| * srichter listens/reads | 17:30 | |
| benji_york | removing the .controls mapping and .getControl method and replacing them with a single .get method that will take name, id, and value parameters | 17:30 |
| benji_york | name will be the default (first) | 17:30 |
| srichter | what will it return? | 17:31 |
| mgedmin | what is name and what is id? | 17:31 |
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| SteveA | why not replace 'controls' with a mapping that has the semantics you need? | 17:32 |
| srichter | name or id of the control | 17:32 |
| mgedmin | ? | 17:32 |
| mgedmin | get(name, id, value) | 17:32 |
| srichter | <input name="foo" id "foobar" ...> | 17:32 |
| mgedmin | or did I misunderstand? | 17:32 |
| srichter | controls are form input controls | 17:32 |
| srichter | benji_york: why did you make this change? | 17:33 |
| srichter | benji_york: I liked the explicit naming of controls | 17:33 |
| srichter | benji_york: or can you get other DOM elements as well? | 17:33 |
| mgedmin | or is it get(name='foo') vs get(id='bar') vs get(value='Submit Changes')? | 17:33 |
| srichter | benji_york: like links, divs, etc | 17:33 |
| mgedmin | ah, it makes sense then | 17:33 |
| srichter | mgedmin: right, you can choose the search parameters | 17:34 |
| benji_york | srichter, Gary's been using it fairly intense use and we've come to realize the semi-magic browser.controls isn't as helpful as I had hoped | 17:34 |
| benji_york | nope, just controls, if you want to do more sophisticated HTML parsing you should use an external package (xpath, beautifulsoup, DOM, etc.) | 17:35 |
| srichter | benji_york: ok, I have barely used .controls too | 17:35 |
| benji_york | mgedmin, it's all of those :) If you specify more than one, they all must match | 17:35 |
| srichter | I use mainly getControl | 17:36 |
| benji_york | srichter, right, so now you'll just use "get" and because most of the time you'll be using "name=" we've made that the first agument | 17:36 |
| srichter | yep, good idea | 17:36 |
| SteveA | get for | 17:36 |
| SteveA | 'get' for get a name, getByValue for get a value and getById for get by id seems clearer to me | 17:37 |
| srichter | benji_york: I think we really should be supporting some sort of sub DOM tree selection | 17:37 |
| srichter | I would really like to say give me the text of the div that has id X | 17:37 |
| * SteveA keeps on bikeshedding... | 17:37 | |
| benji_york | SteveA :) | 17:38 |
| srichter | SteveA: mmh, matter of taste | 17:38 |
| srichter | I don't care either way | 17:38 |
| mgedmin | lxml will be in zope 3.2, won't it? | 17:38 |
| mgedmin | xpath is nice | 17:38 |
| srichter | I would not want this in an application API this way, but for the testbrowser it is fine and convenient | 17:39 |
| SteveA | srichter: maybe. i consider it more a matter of what aspect of the language you're using. all other things being equal, i think it is clearer to use a different method name than to use differently-named arguments | 17:39 |
| srichter | mgedmin: if it gets approved; please comment on the proposal in favor of it :-) | 17:39 |
| benji_york | srichter, I don't want to make a pre-mature choice on that, some people will want to use a DOM-ish API, some xpath, some beautiful soup, some lxml. | 17:39 |
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| srichter | benji_york: DOM takes too long to inspect | 17:40 |
| srichter | one of the greatest benefits of testbrowser is how fast I can verify correctly working code. | 17:42 |
| benji_york | srichter, by "DOM takes too long to inspect" do you mean "too long to write tests" or "too long to run" | 17:42 |
| srichter | too long to write tests | 17:43 |
| srichter | its too much code | 17:43 |
| srichter | if I can say: browser.getElementString('s:div/id=foo') and it returns that sub-element as text, it would be great | 17:44 |
| srichter | (note: I do not know much about XPath, so the XPath string might be wrong) | 17:44 |
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| benji_york | srichter, that's why I don't want to declare the "one true way" of verifying document structure and contents. | 17:51 |
| philiKON | some_lxml_etree.xpath("div[@id='foo']") | 17:51 |
| philiKON | srichter, support anguenot's lxml proposal if you want to be able to do this in z3 tests | 17:52 |
| srichter | I have done so multiple times; I actually asked anguenot to write the proposal ;-) | 17:53 |
| philiKON | ah :) | 17:53 |
| philiKON | goodie then | 17:53 |
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| faassen | yeah, support lxml! :) | 17:55 |
| faassen | anyway, a question about the catalog and sorting. | 17:55 |
| faassen | am I correct that the catalog right now doesn't implement sorting at all, right? | 17:55 |
| faassen | I'm looking into a batched result implementation based on a catalog result set. | 17:56 |
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| faassen | it should also be sorted. | 17:56 |
| faassen | and it should be relatively efficient. | 17:56 |
| faassen | anyone has such a beast for zope 3 lying about? | 17:56 |
| srichter | I think the catalog does not support sorting | 17:56 |
| faassen | right, I think not either. | 17:56 |
| srichter | I have some batching code in bugtracker | 17:56 |
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| faassen | or if so, it's very carefully hidden. perhaps the underlying btrees have a knob for sorting. | 17:57 |
| srichter | ST recently developed similar batching code | 17:57 |
| faassen | ST? | 17:57 |
| srichter | schooltool | 17:57 |
| faassen | ah. | 17:57 |
| faassen | I'll take a look at the bugtracker. | 17:57 |
| faassen | does it also do sorting? | 17:57 |
| srichter | the batching in bugtracker is based on the Z2 equivalent, I think | 17:57 |
| srichter | I think you have to sort yourself first | 17:57 |
| philiKON | batching really isn't that hard; the sorting is | 17:58 |
| faassen | yeah, efficient sorting would be. | 17:59 |
| faassen | I mean, I could simply sort the entire result set. | 17:59 |
| faassen | but that means waking all the objects at once. perhaps that's tolerable. | 18:00 |
| srichter | shrug, addMenuItem does not support layers? :-( | 18:02 |
| faassen | I guess for performance I could also dump the result list in a session or something. | 18:03 |
| faassen | anyway, I'll try it without performance first. :) | 18:04 |
| srichter | menu items in general don't support the layer attribute; its in the handler, just not in the directive schema | 18:04 |
| faassen | thanks for the hint to look at the bugtracker, srichter | 18:04 |
| srichter | no problem | 18:04 |
| philiKON | srichter, ouch | 18:06 |
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| srichter | yep | 18:07 |
| srichter | I guess that should be fixed for RC 2 | 18:07 |
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| MJ | We need Casey... | 18:22 |
| * MJ read up about catalog sorting | 18:22 | |
| srichter | for what? | 18:22 |
| srichter | ah, I see :-) | 18:22 |
| MJ | He did a great job on Z2 catalog sorting.. | 18:23 |
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| srichter | hey all, is there something one should know about includeOverrides? | 18:48 |
| srichter | benji_york: do you use includeOverrides? | 18:48 |
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| benji_york | srichter, sorry, away for lunch... yes I do, why? | 18:57 |
| srichter | benji_york: because it does not work for me | 18:59 |
| srichter | I cannot override an addMenuItem | 18:59 |
| srichter | it is probably because during the menu item registration process many more things get registered | 18:59 |
| srichter | and one of those probably gets not correctly replaced | 18:59 |
| benji_york | ahh, I've had similar problems and haven't spent the time to figure it out :( | 19:07 |
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| srichter | ok | 19:12 |
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| mkerrin | srichter: do you have a couple of minutes | 20:24 |
| srichter | mkerrin: yes | 20:25 |
| srichter | mkerrin: so you don't want to talk to me afterall? ;-) | 20:26 |
| mkerrin | yes - just seen you - I have started looking at this Twisted proposal. | 20:27 |
| srichter | cool! | 20:27 |
| mkerrin | If I am not wrong then most of the proposal is componitizing the server code. | 20:27 |
| srichter | yes | 20:28 |
| mkerrin | right - need to figure out how to do this | 20:30 |
| srichter | what specifically? | 20:31 |
| mkerrin | I was looking at a global utility to start all servers (which we will probable need) but I can't seem to figure out how to handle each of the server types | 20:31 |
| mkerrin | i.e. Twisted has SSL server types, and ZServer doesn't | 20:31 |
| srichter | we should first try to analyze the problem | 20:31 |
| srichter | oh, I see | 20:31 |
| srichter | there will be a zope.app.server and zope.app.twisted package | 20:32 |
| srichter | both come with separate zope.conf schema | 20:32 |
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| mkerrin | and zope.app.zserver (I think) because otherwise we will be loading the zserver code all the time | 20:33 |
| srichter | no, the components that are shared between the two must be factored out | 20:34 |
| srichter | so yes, maybe have zope.app.zserver | 20:34 |
| srichter | no, actually not :-) | 20:34 |
| srichter | we will leave zope.app.server totally alone | 20:34 |
| srichter | we just say it is there for BBB and if people want to use the old server stuff | 20:34 |
| mkerrin | but I was thinking of keeping zope.app.server has the common component | 20:34 |
| srichter | no | 20:35 |
| srichter | we will not touch zope.app.server | 20:35 |
| srichter | and probably not reuse much of it, or is there a lot of useful code in there? | 20:35 |
| mkerrin | main.py which is called by all current Zope3 instances, logging and database configuration | 20:36 |
| srichter | this code needs some abstraction and we might be able to move it to startup or something like that | 20:37 |
| srichter | zope.app.startup that is | 20:38 |
| mkerrin | right - for main.py, and the basic zope.conf configuration but still without the SSL server types | 20:40 |
| srichter | zope.conf will only support SSL when one uses twisted | 20:42 |
| srichter | and twisted will be the default (I think) | 20:42 |
| mkerrin | yes - but for sftp I ended up creating a third server type | 20:43 |
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| srichter | ok, that's no problem | 20:44 |
| srichter | sftp is also only loaded/supported with twisted | 20:44 |
| mkerrin | I think it kind of is. I am trying to find a global utility for both the ZServer and the Twisted server which I can call which is start all servers | 20:45 |
| srichter | ah, you see, if twisted is used, only twisted server types are registered | 20:46 |
| srichter | so, you can simply say: zapi.getAllUtilitiesFor(IServerType) | 20:46 |
| mkerrin | right - so in the zope.conf I specify which ZCML server to load - much like the which site.zcml file to load. | 20:47 |
| srichter | yes | 20:47 |
| srichter | I think we will have 2 site.zcmls | 20:48 |
| srichter | site-zserver.zcml and site-twisted.zcml | 20:48 |
| mkerrin | This is actually my first idea which I have some how lost track off | 20:48 |
| mkerrin | Cool - this is suddenly clearer | 20:49 |
| srichter | great | 20:49 |
| philiKON | srichter, couldn't this be unified somehow? e.g. only one zope.conf schema | 20:51 |
| philiKON | and one zconfig directive | 20:51 |
| philiKON | twisted and zservers would register server types with different names, maybe? | 20:51 |
| srichter | no, because twisted needs also SSL info | 20:52 |
| srichter | we are planning to fade out zope.app.server, so we want to leave it as it is | 20:52 |
| srichter | Jim suggested 2 schemas and I tend to agree | 20:53 |
| srichter | the more we try to factor out common code the uglier it will be | 20:53 |
| srichter | and its not like we are hooking up new servers all the time | 20:53 |
| philiKON | ok | 20:54 |
| * mgedmin is sometimes slightly annoyed that there's zapi.provideUtility and ztapi.provideUtility, and the order of arguments is reversed between the two | 20:55 | |
| srichter | I think we should concetrate on the use cases that we really want to implement: allow custom requests and make it really easy to hook up HTTP-related protocols | 20:56 |
| srichter | mgedmin: we are fading out ztapi | 20:56 |
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| mkerrin | srichter: are you talking talking about making a name utility out of like say IPublicationRequestFactory and then specify this in the zope.conf file inside a server type option | 21:07 |
| srichter | yeah | 21:13 |
| srichter | or leave it even unnamed | 21:13 |
| srichter | just to have a way to override the setting | 21:13 |
| mkerrin | unnamed = default request factory. | 21:14 |
| srichter | for example | 21:15 |
| srichter | or just have them always be unnamed | 21:15 |
| srichter | but allow in ZCML to override the registration | 21:16 |
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| roym | Folks, I have a schema TextLine field called 'foo'; I am making a | 23:12 |
| roym | custom edit.html page... how would I (in a ZPT page) make the | 23:12 |
| roym | auto-generated edit view for 'foo' display? | 23:12 |
| roym | 23:12 | |
| roym | I sort of got the impression (from srichter's) book that | 23:12 |
| roym | view/foo_widget would work, but it doesn't :( | 23:12 |
| srichter | yeah that should work | 23:13 |
| srichter | do you use the editform directive? | 23:14 |
| roym | oh - no I didn't... let me look it up; thanks. | 23:14 |
| roym | actually, if I were to use the <page> directive, would I be able | 23:14 |
| srichter | yeah, macros are only available in combination with the editform, addform, or form directive | 23:14 |
| srichter | nope, does not work | 23:14 |
| srichter | you would have to do the setup of the widgets manually | 23:15 |
| roym | sigh - it would be a nice feature someday to allow general re-use. | 23:15 |
| srichter | nope | 23:15 |
| philiKON | roym, you can do general reuse | 23:15 |
| srichter | because pages are not bound to schemas | 23:15 |
| philiKON | roym, just initialize the widget yourself in python | 23:16 |
| srichter | you can use the new form directive | 23:16 |
| roym | If I initialize the widget in python, wouldn't I end up having to create a | 23:16 |
| srichter | See zope.app.form.browser/form.txt | 23:17 |
| roym | <page> directive for each widget? | 23:17 |
| srichter | no | 23:17 |
| philiKON | roym, no, no... just write a python class that accompanies your ZPT | 23:17 |
| philiKON | acquire the widget there | 23:17 |
| philiKON | and initialize it | 23:17 |
| srichter | I think your safest bet is using the new browser:form directive documented above | 23:17 |
| philiKON | probably | 23:17 |
| roym | quick tangent - do you know of a directive to allow an empty string as a valid value in a vocabulary? | 23:19 |
| roym | I have a Choice field... | 23:20 |
| srichter | that should work | 23:20 |
| roym | ok - thanks. | 23:21 |
| MJ | Hmmm | 23:25 |
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| MJ | I can't seem to get a localUtility registered in such a way that I can add it | 23:25 |
| srichter | mmh | 23:26 |
| _drzoltron | is it possible to connect to unixODBC from Z3 ? | 23:26 |
| MJ | I see the <browser:tool> in the SiteManagement view | 23:26 |
| srichter | did you use the <localutility> directive? | 23:26 |
| MJ | Yes | 23:26 |
| srichter | mmh, ok | 23:26 |
| srichter | did you use an addMenuItem? | 23:26 |
| MJ | No | 23:26 |
| srichter | (I guess you just copied existing code anyways) | 23:26 |
| MJ | I extrapolated from Philips book more | 23:27 |
| MJ | Phillip (double l) | 23:27 |
| _drzoltron | I read in a zope3-dev IRC log that a DMHarden managed to connect and wonder if his code might be somewhere .... | 23:27 |
| MJ | Or was it one l :) | 23:27 |
| _drzoltron | he says: "DMHardenI have hacked together an ODBC DA based off some CVS source I found on Google - srichter's :)" | 23:28 |
| MJ | srichter: so I need a localUtility, a browser:tool and a browser:addMenuItem? | 23:28 |
| _drzoltron | srichter: do you know what he is talking about ? | 23:28 |
| srichter | MJ: yeah, you need addMenuItem for the menu entry | 23:29 |
| MJ | Okay | 23:29 |
| MJ | Thanks | 23:29 |
| srichter | _drzoltron: not wiothout more context... | 23:29 |
| srichter | I think several people have connected to Oracle | 23:29 |
| srichter | using various dirvers | 23:29 |
| _drzoltron | srichter: http://zope3.pov.lt/irclogs/%23zope3-dev.2005-03-07.log.html ->> close to the bottom of the page | 23:30 |
| srichter | if you get Python conencted to Oracle, then Zope is no problem | 23:30 |
| _drzoltron | srichter: well I got mdbtools working with unixODBC | 23:30 |
| _drzoltron | maybe I should look into pyODB ? | 23:31 |
| MJ | bingo. | 23:31 |
| MJ | srichter: thanks | 23:31 |
| srichter | don't ask me; I hjave no clue about ODBC | 23:31 |
| _drzoltron | hehe | 23:31 |
| srichter | MJ: no problemo | 23:31 |
| srichter | I just know that if you get Python connected to ODBC, then the Zope 3 adapter is the simple part | 23:32 |
| srichter | (even if you have to write it yourself) | 23:32 |
| _drzoltron | srichter: exactly ! | 23:32 |
| _drzoltron | sounds good | 23:32 |
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