IRC log of #zope3-dev for Thursday, 2006-04-06

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einshi romanofski :)09:47
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einshow do I get interfaces that are provided by some class?13:14
srichterfrom zope.interface import providedBy13:16
srichterbut usually this is not a sensible query13:16
einswell I don't have IMyInterface there, I want to get it13:17
srichterbut how do you know to get it from this list?13:18
einsprovidedBy() I need all interfaces that are provided13:19
einsI need all interfaces that are provided13:19
srichterwhat for?13:20
srichterI have never needed this other than for APIDOC13:20
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einsjust playing around. trying to get all attribute names from all interfaces that are provided by a class13:22
srichterah ok13:22
srichterthis is similar to the APIDOC case then13:22
srichternote that in real life you almost never want that, since you want control over what things you display13:23
einsprovidedBy(object).__dict__['declared'] works but looks pretty ugly13:23
srichterso you are usually working in the mode of addressing one interface at a time13:23
srichterit should work without the __dict__ bit13:23
einsnot, it doesnt: TypeError: unsubscriptable object13:24
einsI thought so too..13:24
srichtermmh, ok13:24
srichterlet me check that13:24
srichterok, so providedBy returns a declaration13:27
srichtera declaration extends specification13:28
srichterand specification has a get() method13:28
srichterI knew there was something. :-)13:28
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einsthanks srichter ;)13:32
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einsspecification even has interfaces() which is good:13:34
einsnow I have what I needed. thanks again srichter ;)13:35
srichteryou are welcome13:39
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srichtermkerrin: do you think you'll finish the WebDAV stuff for the next release?14:24
mkerrinsrichter: unlikely - I have very little time at the moment. I really want to get back to it though.14:35
mkerrinBTW - I am involved in a project that ported the PrimaGIS plone mapping product to Zope3, as a side project to get it to run under CPS via Five - you may be interested in knowing.14:37
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srichtermkerrin: very cool!14:51
mkerrinsrichter: hopefully I can get around to making a more formal announced next week instead a random remark on IRC14:56
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d2mhow would i override the loading of in zope/app/configure.zcml (which is loaded from site.zcml) ?15:01
srichtermkerrin: he he; I just checked it out; it's pretty cool15:03
srichter(the Zope 2 version that is)15:04
srichterd2m: what do you try to accomplish?15:04
d2mthe skins are loaded by default, even when i want toi use my own skin, they get loaded (and are available throuf directives)15:05
d2mi figured that i would need to patch zope/app/configure.zcml and browser.zcml (which is not what i want)15:06
d2msrichter: in short, i do not want the skins to be available TTW15:08
srichteryou have to modify z.a.configure.zcml15:11
srichteran alternative is to rewrite the site.zcml and *not* load zope/app/configure.zcml and build your own15:11
srichterSchooltool is doing this15:11
efgemkerrin: not z3 related, but you know there's a CPSGeo product?15:11
d2mok, i'll look there - thanks15:12
srichterone big added benefit to the latter approach has the advantage that you can be more selective15:12
srichterfor example SchoolTool (including its not so small configuration leads in less than 2 secs on my computer in comparison to 4.4 secs for all of Zope 3 (without dev mode)15:12
efgemkerrin: janguenot would like to discuss geo products with you, he tells me he'll email you or will find you on irc (too busy now :))15:13
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mkerrinefge: np - I am just going out for some food now - but I will be happy to talk about any of the GEO related stuff15:28
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srichterbenji: how open are you guys to zc.table improvements?16:04
srichterI have two things in mind:16:04
benjiquite open, srichter16:04
srichterHave base CSS classes for all tags by default16:04
srichterthis would cover a *lot* of occasions for subclassing16:04
srichterthe second would be macro-based column cell rendering16:05
benjiI think default CSS classes would be good; perhaps with a common prefix16:05
srichterI have some fairly complex columns and typing the stuff in Python is getting old quickly16:05
srichterbenji: right16:05
srichterjust something that you can change easily too16:05
benjiI don't quite get what you're saying about the macro-based cell rendering though16:06
srichterlike: formatter:tableClass = 'myclass'16:06
benji(and it's been a while csince I looked at the code)16:06
srichterbenji: I have cells that are more than simple values or fields16:06
benjiand you're making your own column for them?16:06
srichterthey have links and display several things make decisions about icons etc16:06
srichterbut writing all this HTML in Python is getting old very quickly16:07
srichterThus I propose (as a base class not default) a formatter that contains a template that contains ZPT macros16:07
benjiso, a new column type that has a template it uses to format the cells, makes sense to me16:08
srichtera special column (MacroColumn or PTColumn) will then use one of the macros in the template to render its cell value16:08
srichterbut I do not want to write a template for each and every column16:08
benjiwhy would it "use one of the macros in the template", and not just juse the whole template?16:08
srichterthen you have template proliferation :-)16:08
benjidisk space is cheap :)16:09
srichterthat's not the reason16:09
srichterit's my sanity :-)16:09
srichterI think macros are usually perfect for small HTML snippets16:09
srichterand I would have all column macros in one template together16:09
benjiI still don't like the idea of munging all the cell formatter PTs in one file and using macros to pull them out, but that shouldn't stop you fom doing it, that particular column can be private to you16:10
benjithe beauty of componentization :)16:10
srichterit would certainly be an addition instead of a replacement or extension16:10
srichter(I just would prefer also not maintaining the code in a separate project ;-)16:11
srichterok, I will make those changes16:12
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srichterprobably will take me while though16:13
srichterbut overall, I love zc.table; it's a lot of fun working with it16:13
srichterbenji: btw, how do you handle table widths?16:13
srichterI mean column widths?16:13
benjinormally we don't force a width16:14
srichtermmh, ok, I definitely need this16:14
benjiwe then make things not wrap if neccesary, and also use an abbreviator to make long strings shorter16:15
srichterwell, I have to fulfill a specific design, so I do not have that choice :-(16:17
srichtermmh, ok16:18
srichtermaybe I'll use the suggested hack from the README16:18
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baldtroli posted a sorta-related question to zope3-users mailing list a moment ago, but a fresh question has sprung to mind, and i thought it might be better brought up here...  if i create an EditForm derivative with formlib, is it possible to present it through a viewlet?  basically i'd like to build a user portal that allows a user to modify multiple sets of data associated to their profile from a single "dashboard" type interface.18:21
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srichterbaldtrol: absolutely18:22
srichterjust make the edit form also comply to the viewlet API18:23
baldtrolsrichter: i figured ;)  would you just make the "render" method a call to __call__?18:23
baldtrolthe render method on the viewlet, i mean18:23
srichterthey both share the update/render pattern18:23
srichterno, just do not implement __call__18:23
srichterit is not required b any API18:23
srichterwell, that's not true18:23
srichterit is required for a standalone edit form, but not if used in a viewlet18:24
baldtrolhmm...  ok.  i had always assumed that __call__ was kinda magiced behind the scenes when you gave it a template18:24
philiKONsrichter, got a sec?18:24
srichterall that __call__ usually does is: self.template()18:24
srichterall that __call__ usually does is: return self.template()18:24
srichterphiliKON: not really, but shoot18:24
baldtrolright, right.18:24
philiKONsrichter, ok, i'll make it short. two things:18:25
philiKON1. contains a) translations for the 'zope' domain, b) some i18n tools18:25
philiKONi think the i18n tools (extractor) should move to zope.i18n18:25
philiKONwith the translations, i'm not sure18:25
philiKONzope.formlib has introduced its own translation domain18:25
srichterok to the i18n tools moving18:25
srichterI wonder why it was not there...18:25
philiKONshould translations be kept centrally or in the individual packages?18:25
philiKONsrichter, because we were lazy ;)18:26
srichterwell, honestly I am now at a point where I would like each package maintain its own translation18:26
srichterthis has two drawbacks:18:26
srichter(1) you need to fix the translation utility to accept multiple files for the same domain18:26
srichter(2) Will cause duplications in translations (lot's of them too, probably)18:27
srichterI think leaving them in for now and stating that they are app server specific is the sanest thing to do18:27
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srichterI am really torn here18:27
srichtersince the issue runs even deeper18:28
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philiKONad (1):18:28
srichterwhen I write a custom application, I often want to control the translations18:28
philiKONeach zope.* package could maintain its own domain18:28
philiKONthat would solve the multiple files thing18:28
srichternow, I am using formlib in an applications and part of the messages are in the zope domain and some in my custom one18:28
philiKONad (2): yep :(18:28
srichterthat really sucks18:28
philiKONa central domain is easier in lots of ways18:29
philiKONi wonder how plone does it for the gazillion products they have18:29
srichterme too18:29
srichterrockyburt: ???? (see above)18:29
rockyburtasking about domains?18:30
philiKONrockyburt, yes18:30
rockyburtto be quite frank i do very little i18n18:30
philiKONrockyburt, does archetypes have its own i18n domain?18:30
rockyburtoh, lemme check18:30
srichterphiliKON: I think the best would be to start treating domains more abstractly18:30
srichterphiliKON: so when I have my custom project, I collect all messages from formlib and translate them myself18:31
rockyburtit looks like archetypes uses the plone i18n domain18:31
philiKONi see18:31
srichterI could use the standard zope PO files as a translation memory18:31
rockyburtat least the couple .pt's i just checked have i18n:domain="plone"18:31
rockyburtin archetypes18:31
srichterbtw, KBabel now supports translation memories!18:32
philiKONperhaps for now it would be best to move the extractor tool etc. to zope.i18n and to zope.translations perhaps?18:33
srichterI would leave the POs in zope.app18:34
srichterthey are app server specific18:34
philiKONexcept that they aren't :)18:34
philiKONtranslations for stuff in zope.* should be accessible too18:35
philiKONperhaps we should postpone this issue18:35
srichterthis needs some really hard thinking18:35
philiKONbut we'll have to deal with it at some point18:35
srichter(darn, and I thought this subject was done with)18:36
philiKONsame as with the ISite thing18:36
srichterahat about ISite?18:36
philiKONwell, it needs to move somewhere18:36
philiKONbut j1m doesn't want it in zope.component18:36
srichterI would put it in zope.local or zope.localcomponent18:37
philiKONthat would work. i suggested
srichtereven would be ok18:37
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philiKONsrichter, another suggestion18:46 feels misplaced18:46
philiKONi'd like to move it to zope.publisher.browser.BrowserPage18:46
srichterit should also have an abstract __call__ method18:47
baldtrol+.0005 (it'd be +1, but i multiplied it by how much my vote should really count ;) )18:48
srichterphiliKON: formlib itself needs serious cleanup as well18:49
philiKONyeah @ cleanup18:49
srichterphiliKON: the test coverage and documentation must be improved18:49
srichterphiliKON: also, it violates naming conventions left and right18:49
philiKONdunno what you mean by "abstract __call__", but it *does* have a __call__ that raises NotImplementedError, i think18:49
philiKONah, you're right18:50
srichter(I am very bumped that I did not have a closer look before it was added to the core)18:50
philiKONit doesn't provide a __call__18:50
srichterphiliKON: __call__ right18:50
philiKONso, it should provide a __call__ that raises NotImplementedError18:50
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sawdoghey zack21:16
baldtrolsrichter: i've managed to place a form in a viewlet (which wasn't terribly difficult, as you indicated ;) ), but i still run into the problem where the form render seems to re-render the whole zmi inside of itself.  if i, in tal, get to where i can do a tal:content="python: viewlet.template" it shows that it's using the template i assigned it in the zcml, but my template in no way re-renders the zmi.  it's, as a matter of fact (to make sure i wasn't doin21:26
baldtroli tried creating an adapter for my own named template and assigning that named template to template = namedtemplate.NamedTemplate('mytemplate') in my form class, but it threw an error :\21:27
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srichterbaldtrol: of course you cannot just use the entire default template22:27
srichteryou have to use the macro that only displays the form22:27
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baldtrolsrichter: i thought, from looking at it, that that's what the would do, if i associated it.  the way it reads, the only macro it's implementing is form.23:02
baldtrol(sorry for the delay...  work duties ;) )23:02
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baldtrolkamalgill: thanks again man :)23:10
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kamalgillbaldtrol: sorry? thx for?23:11
kamalgilloh, got it23:11
baldtrol<-- pete from thig  (sorry)23:11
kamalgillright, now i understand :)23:11
kamalgillyou're welcome--looking forward to meeting you in SF23:12
baldtrolyessir, quite.23:12
kamalgillbtw, anyone here know the latest status of the new
kamalgillanyone working on
kamalgillanyone else here think we could use a kick-ass site?23:16
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baldtrolthat last one i can say yes to ;)23:16
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kamalgillbaldtrol: fantastic.23:17
kamalgillanyone else?23:17
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kamalgilli'd like to volunteer to help with the new site, but i'm not sure whom to contact to get this going23:20
benjisomeone is working on it kamalgill, let me see if the checkins show who...23:20
kamalgillbenji: thx23:20
benjiuser name: oestermeier23:21
benjithe code is in /zope3org/trunk23:21
kamalgillis that Uwe Oestermeier?23:22
benjiI would assume so :)23:22
baldtrollater on everyone23:23
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