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| alecm | j1m: So MacYET and philiKON suggested I pop in here and harass you for Zope commit privileges (in particular so I can commit the fix for http://www.zope.org/Collectors/Zope/2072). :-) | 03:50 |
|---|---|---|
| turiax | To what extent is zope3 a mature product? | 03:54 |
| turiax | More specifically, what important things are missing from it? | 03:54 |
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| eins | hi | 08:18 |
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| romanofski | moin | 10:23 |
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| J1m_ | philiKON, I'm hoping that I can merge the branch next week. | 13:50 |
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| dlk | philiKON: ayt? | 13:55 |
| rockyburt | J1m_: you referring to the large branch that you and philip are current working on? | 13:57 |
| J1m_ | yup | 13:57 |
| rockyburt | great, i've been reading wonderful things are happening on that branch and you were afraid it'd never get merged ;) | 13:57 |
| * rockyburt eats one of his kids wildberry poptarts to celebrate | 13:58 | |
| J1m_ | It really *has* to get merged. | 13:58 |
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| J1m_ | Since some Five work is depending on it afaik | 13:58 |
| rockyburt | oh wow | 13:58 |
| rockyburt | is that the branch that has some of the local component registration stuff that you and phillip did at the pycon sprint? | 13:59 |
| * rockyburt thinks he may be confusing things now | 13:59 | |
| J1m_ | yes | 13:59 |
| J1m_ | It really has 3 big things: | 13:59 |
| rockyburt | great ... local view component registration is something the plone community is desperately hoping will land for our further progression to zope3 techniques in zope2 ;) | 13:59 |
| J1m_ | 1. Adapter redesign that speeds Zope 3 up about 100% | 14:00 |
| * rockyburt wows at #1 | 14:00 | |
| J1m_ | 2. Major registration simplification, especially for local registration | 14:00 |
| J1m_ | 3. Philipps work on moving things out of zope.app. | 14:01 |
| J1m_ | 1 & 2 also set the stage for a bunch of other things. | 14:01 |
| rockyburt | thats some pretty cool stuff | 14:01 |
| J1m_ | yes | 14:01 |
| rockyburt | what kind of things will 1 & 2 set the stage for? | 14:01 |
| J1m_ | Unfortunately I won't have time to make progress on eggs for this release cycle. :( | 14:02 |
| J1m_ | well, for example: | 14:02 |
| J1m_ | - a "super" adapter lookup, akin to Python super method lookup | 14:02 |
| J1m_ | - named subscribers | 14:02 |
| J1m_ | - definition of local registration in zcml or file system | 14:03 |
| rockyburt | oh nice | 14:03 |
| J1m_ | - better control of registration for test setup/teardown, especially for layers | 14:03 |
| J1m_ | - more speedups in the future | 14:04 |
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| rockyburt | the 100% zope3 speedup for adapters will be very nice | 14:05 |
| J1m_ | yup | 14:05 |
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| efge | is there any schema field type defined somewhere in zope for a file-like stream? | 16:08 |
| efge | or should I say Object(schema=IFile)... ? for a suitable IFile | 16:10 |
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| philiKON | j1m, good to hear. i'll try to help with the deprecdation warnings | 16:32 |
| philiKON | efge, hurry.file has that | 16:33 |
| efge | ok thanks I'll check that | 16:34 |
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| efge | if I have a container interface with a __setitem__.precondition, and that the interface it inherits from also has one, shouldn't the inherited precondition also be checked by zope.app.container.constraints.checkObject? I don't see that in checkObject's code.. | 16:51 |
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| alecm | j1m: ping | 17:16 |
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| whit | is zope.testing going to be available as an egg? | 18:04 |
| whit | or perhaps is already? | 18:04 |
| * whit should just go look | 18:04 | |
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| philiKON | whit, it's already | 18:29 |
| whit | nice! | 18:29 |
| philiKON | whit, http://download.zope.org/distribution/ | 18:31 |
| whit | danke...didn't know about that... | 18:31 |
| philiKON | bitte :) | 18:32 |
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| drzoltron_ | Hi | 18:39 |
| drzoltron_ | field2string throws me an encoding error when it gets input from a form containing national characters, any idea ? | 18:41 |
| philiKON | what on earth are you trying to do?!? | 18:41 |
| drzoltron_ | hi philiKON :) | 18:41 |
| philiKON | hey :) | 18:42 |
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| drzoltron_ | philiKON: page one with <form action="@@results" method="post"> | 18:42 |
| drzoltron_ | page results a BrowserView with a reuest.get() in the __init__ | 18:43 |
| drzoltron_ | works wonderfully with non-nationalistic-fascistoid characters | 18:43 |
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| drzoltron_ | philiKON: check here: http://zope3.pastebin.com/671505 | 18:45 |
| philiKON | why are you doing field2str() ?!?! | 18:45 |
| philiKON | zope.publisher gives you unicode | 18:45 |
| philiKON | you should be happy | 18:45 |
| philiKON | ah, wait | 18:46 |
| drzoltron_ | I am not doing field2string, the publisher does | 18:46 |
| philiKON | it's the zope.publisher that's doing this | 18:46 |
| philiKON | my bad | 18:46 |
| drzoltron_ | exactly | 18:46 |
| drzoltron_ | ... which I did not code ;) | 18:46 |
| drzoltron_ | I just do a self.fritekst = request.get('fritekst') | 18:46 |
| philiKON | this should work | 18:47 |
| philiKON | i wonder why it doesn't | 18:47 |
| drzoltron_ | could it be some settings in the html form ? | 18:47 |
| philiKON | don't think so | 18:48 |
| philiKON | i wonder about the Accept-Charset settings of the browser | 18:48 |
| philiKON | what browser are you using? | 18:48 |
| drzoltron_ | safari | 18:48 |
| philiKON | tried with ff? | 18:48 |
| drzoltron_ | right npow | 18:49 |
| drzoltron_ | now | 18:49 |
| drzoltron_ | much better | 18:49 |
| philiKON | i bet safari f*cks up by sending something in Accept-Charset that zope can't understand | 18:50 |
| philiKON | possibly the Accept-Charset: * bug is coming into play here | 18:50 |
| philiKON | BjornT is on that, afaik :) | 18:50 |
| drzoltron_ | philiKON: no sorry, same problem | 18:50 |
| philiKON | hmm | 18:50 |
| philiKON | what kind of character are you inserting? | 18:51 |
| philiKON | and what encoding is the form presented in? | 18:51 |
| drzoltron_ | a fascistoid æ | 18:51 |
| drzoltron_ | hmm | 18:51 |
| drzoltron_ | utf-8 | 18:51 |
| philiKON | hmmmm | 18:51 |
| drzoltron_ | can i set encoding on a form ? | 18:51 |
| philiKON | well, the whole page | 18:51 |
| philiKON | zope sends out a page in a certain encoding | 18:52 |
| drzoltron_ | <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;charset=utf-8" /> ? | 18:52 |
| philiKON | naaah | 18:52 |
| BjornT | philiKON, drzoltron: i don't think this has anything to do with Accept-Charset | 18:52 |
| philiKON | zope sends out a *real* content-type header | 18:52 |
| philiKON | Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 | 18:52 |
| philiKON | BjornT, perhaps you can take over. i have no idea what's going wrong for drzoltron_ | 18:52 |
| drzoltron_ | BjornT: would be nice if you could | 18:53 |
| philiKON | drzoltron_, wait. setItemWithType | 18:53 |
| philiKON | drzoltron_, can i see your form? | 18:53 |
| drzoltron_ | online ? | 18:53 |
| BjornT | drzoltron_: can you past the source for the html form somewhere? | 18:53 |
| drzoltron_ | yeah | 18:53 |
| philiKON | drzoltron_, yeah, post it somewhere | 18:53 |
| drzoltron_ | 2 sec | 18:53 |
| philiKON | i bet you're doing :list or something | 18:53 |
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| drzoltron_ | philiKON & BjornT: http://zope3.pastebin.com/671520 | 18:55 |
| philiKON | yeah. why are you doing text | 18:55 |
| philiKON | :text | 18:55 |
| philiKON | no wonder you're getting the error | 18:55 |
| philiKON | i think :utext is better than :text here because it's uncode | 18:55 |
| philiKON | but it's completely unnecessary anyways | 18:55 |
| philiKON | don't use :<something> fields | 18:55 |
| philiKON | use proper field validation, e.g. with zope.formlib | 18:56 |
| philiKON | then you also won't have to write them form yourself ;) | 18:56 |
| drzoltron_ | philiKON: good point, happens when you get the form from a skinning-guy ! | 18:56 |
| drzoltron_ | who never has seen any zope3 before in his life ;) | 18:56 |
| drzoltron_ | thax | 18:56 |
| drzoltron_ | dankescheeeen | 18:56 |
| philiKON | :) | 18:57 |
| drzoltron_ | philiKON: will definately look into formlib | 18:58 |
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| philiKON | for now you can just forget about :text | 18:58 |
| drzoltron_ | philiKON: will | 18:59 |
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| philiKON | http://dev.zope.org/Zope3/TheBrowserPageCompromise | 20:05 |
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| SteveA | philiKON: i'm doing something like this with launchpad, but i have an additional requirement, and i don't have some of the requirements you give | 20:07 |
| philiKON | i'm open for suggestions | 20:08 |
| philiKON | note that this *is* a compromise as the name said | 20:08 |
| SteveA | one thing that i want to do is to have a single presentation class that has several "entry points", one per registered page | 20:08 |
| philiKON | example? | 20:08 |
| SteveA | i can't do this right now because of how the magic mixins are generated in the zcml processing code | 20:08 |
| philiKON | ah, ok. i thought you had this | 20:09 |
| philiKON | well, <browser:page /> won't do any magic anymore. it will just take a factory and register it as an adapter. basta | 20:09 |
| philiKON | doesn't even have to be a class anymore | 20:09 |
| SteveA | the way i planned to do this is: | 20:09 |
| SteveA | use a different directive than browser:page, that does no magic | 20:09 |
| SteveA | have a map of page names to method names | 20:10 |
| SteveA | in the publish traverse code for these presentation classes, use that map | 20:10 |
| philiKON | nice | 20:11 |
| philiKON | i've thought about something like that too | 20:11 |
| SteveA | i'd elect to do this stuff by subclassing | 20:11 |
| SteveA | this keeps the infrastructure obvious, but without any boilerplate | 20:11 |
| SteveA | i also want to look at using decorators to say where the entrypoints are | 20:11 |
| philiKON | yeah. perhaps this should replace <browser:pages> (the plural one) | 20:11 |
| SteveA | so something like | 20:11 |
| SteveA | @pagemethod('index.html') | 20:11 |
| SteveA | def index(self): | 20:12 |
| SteveA | 20:12 | |
| SteveA | @pagemethod('foo.html') | 20:12 |
| philiKON | yes, i had this idea once | 20:12 |
| SteveA | def foo(self): | 20:12 |
| SteveA | 20:12 | |
| SteveA | and to be able to do the same kind of thing for plain templates | 20:12 |
| SteveA | and always have templates declared directly in the class definition | 20:12 |
| philiKON | as said, i ahd this idea once (with the decorators), but it wasn't all too well received | 20:12 |
| philiKON | see http://www.z3lab.org/sections/blogs/philipp-weitershausen/2005_12_14_zcml-needs-to-do-less | 20:12 |
| SteveA | perhaps it isn't for zope3 core | 20:13 |
| philiKON | possibly | 20:13 |
| SteveA | but it will be very nice for launchpad | 20:13 |
| alecm | philiKON: So there will no longer be a way to access a view method directly from outside the view (because there's no more allowed_*)? | 20:13 |
| philiKON | alecm, as you said, you're talking about views, not pages | 20:13 |
| philiKON | <browser:view> is for views that access things | 20:13 |
| philiKON | err | 20:13 |
| philiKON | that you want to access things from | 20:13 |
| philiKON | like, absolute_url, etc | 20:13 |
| philiKON | your @@Ploen thing | 20:13 |
| SteveA | and i have received permission and encouragement to split zope3-related infrastructure off from launchpad, and make it available under something like the ZPL | 20:13 |
| SteveA | so, i'm starting work on that, but it won't be there for a while, as i'm quite busy | 20:14 |
| alecm | philiKON: As long as I still have something that I allows me to do context/@@view/method from a template or tal expression, I'm happy | 20:14 |
| philiKON | yes | 20:14 |
| philiKON | but @@view won't be a browser page | 20:15 |
| philiKON | :) | 20:15 |
| alecm | ok | 20:15 |
| philiKON | SteveA, that definitely sounds great | 20:15 |
| regebro | SteveA: What is the difference between your case ans what broswer:pages does in the proposal? | 20:15 |
| SteveA | i'd also like to use jim's component stuff to say adapts(IWhatever, IBrowserRequest) or something | 20:15 |
| SteveA | regebro: they all do the same thing in the end -- register views on objects | 20:16 |
| SteveA | ... but i need to think about that syntax | 20:16 |
| regebro | Sure, but when I read above your description, so me it sound exactly what browser:pages does. | 20:16 |
| mgedmin | philiKON: how exactly is a browser page different from a browser view? | 20:16 |
| philiKON | mgedmin, explaining that right now in an email | 20:17 |
| philiKON | mgedmin, wait 2 mins, ok :) | 20:17 |
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| philiKON | regebro, mgedmin, in short, a page is soemthing that's publsihed. a view is not (in general) | 20:17 |
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| philiKON | browser:view should die in favour of just <view /> | 20:17 |
| SteveA | really? | 20:18 |
| SteveA | that's interesting | 20:18 |
| regebro | I understand a view as having attributes, while a page is the attribute. :) | 20:18 |
| SteveA | would you enclose it in some grouping element to say that it is for IBrowserRequest ? | 20:18 |
| regebro | philiKON: In the proposal, browser:page use factory where browser:pages use class. That seems inconsistent. | 20:19 |
| philiKON | it's not | 20:19 |
| philiKON | browser:page is consitent with adapter | 20:20 |
| philiKON | and it can eat any factory | 20:20 |
| philiKON | even a function | 20:20 |
| philiKON | browser:pages *needs* a class | 20:20 |
| philiKON | that's because it will still do magic | 20:20 |
| regebro | Ah, ok, got it. | 20:20 |
| mgedmin | +1 for TheBrowserPageCompromise | 20:21 |
| philiKON | regebro, your conception of view vs. page as an attribute is a bit mixed up | 20:21 |
| philiKON | a page is a view that's self-publishable | 20:21 |
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| mgedmin | so a page is a view that provides IBrowserPublisher? | 20:21 |
| mgedmin | while a view doesn't have to provide anything? | 20:21 |
| philiKON | right | 20:23 |
| philiKON | hence it isn't publishable in a URL | 20:23 |
| philiKON | the publisher will always adapt to IBrowserPublisher | 20:23 |
| philiKON | for browser:view thingies there's no such adapter | 20:23 |
| regebro | Don't like it, but got it. :) | 20:24 |
| regebro | Why does it need to do magic? | 20:24 |
| mgedmin | because a single class can only have one __call__ | 20:24 |
| mgedmin | and browser:pages registers a few callable things that need to return different things when called | 20:24 |
| mgedmin | so browser:pages needs to create classes dynamically | 20:24 |
| regebro | Aha. OK, a page is a view that is self publishable. I ALMOST understand that. | 20:25 |
| philiKON | mgedmin, yes, it'll still have to create classes dynamically. browser:pages serves usecase #3 and it's part of the compromise :) | 20:25 |
| philiKON | regebro, right now, when you do <browser:page /> several times fo rthe same class, every time a new dynamically-generated subclass of that class is registered as an adapter | 20:26 |
| philiKON | if you still want that for brevity in ZCML, you can continue to use <browser:pages> | 20:26 |
| regebro | One problem is that browser:pages sounds like it just does browser:page many times. :) | 20:26 |
| philiKON | true | 20:26 |
| philiKON | it currently does | 20:26 |
| philiKON | perhaps it should get a different name | 20:26 |
| philiKON | browser:pagesFromClass | 20:27 |
| philiKON | ? | 20:27 |
| regebro | That's fine by me. | 20:27 |
| regebro | So, when you do what I do most of the time, have more or less one view class per object, but use a host of templates for that view class.... | 20:28 |
| regebro | ...you need to specifically add those templates to the class with PageTemplateFile(whatever).... | 20:28 |
| regebro | ...and the do browser:pagesFromClass listing those attributes. | 20:28 |
| philiKON | yep | 20:29 |
| philiKON | you'd pretty much do that now anyways | 20:29 |
| regebro | Yeah, except that I actually have one statement per page instead of using pages. :) | 20:29 |
| philiKON | ok :) | 20:30 |
| philiKON | gotta go, supper | 20:30 |
| regebro | No problem. Lets discuss more on mail. | 20:30 |
| philiKON | if you got further questions or concerns, please email :) | 20:30 |
| philiKON | yep | 20:30 |
| philiKON | perhaps you can also mention the browser:pagesFromClass idea | 20:30 |
| philiKON | in case i forget ;) | 20:31 |
| regebro | Sure. | 20:31 |
| philiKON | bbl | 20:31 |
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| alecm | j1m: Pretty pretty please may I have Zope commit access? :-) | 21:10 |
| rockyburt | lol | 21:14 |
| rockyburt | don't do it! | 21:14 |
| rockyburt | :) | 21:14 |
| rockyburt | alecm: you mean you've been the plone release manager for all this time and you haven't had zope commit access? wow ;) | 21:14 |
| j1m | alecm, did you submit a contrib agreement? | 21:16 |
| alecm | j1m: Long ago (twice), but I'll fax another one over if needed. | 21:16 |
| j1m | Must have fallen though the cracks. Odd. | 21:17 |
| j1m | Can you email a scanned image to me? | 21:17 |
| j1m | scanned agreement | 21:17 |
| alecm | sure | 21:17 |
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| j1m | That seems to be the most reliable way. | 21:17 |
| alecm | OK, currently the computer connected to my scanner is acting up, but I'll get it to you by the end of the day. | 21:18 |
| j1m | k | 21:18 |
| j1m | sorry we missed it before. | 21:18 |
| alecm | np | 21:19 |
| * alecm gets excited about all the damage he will be able to do ;-) | 21:19 | |
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| whit | anybody been bitten by trying to use setuptool .6a11, zope eggs, and Zope 2.9 on a Mac? | 21:32 |
| whit | case insensitivity appears to wreak havoc if you have zope eggs in your easy_install.pth | 21:32 |
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| alecm | j1m: You should have my ZCA in your inbox | 22:55 |
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| j1m | so I do. :) | 22:55 |
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| j1m | alecm, you should have instructions for uploading your keys in your mailbox. :) | 22:57 |
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| alecm | and so I do :-) | 22:59 |
| alecm | j1m: And everything seems to be working. Thanks! | 23:03 |
| * RaFromBRC cheers | 23:03 | |
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| whit | yay | 23:19 |
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