IRC log of #zope3-dev for Wednesday, 2006-04-26

*** natea has joined #zope3-dev00:05
*** efrerich has quit IRC00:07
*** rockyburt|away is now known as rockyburt00:08
*** sashav has quit IRC00:13
*** regebro has quit IRC00:14
*** natea is now known as natea|sanfran00:21
*** kamalgill has joined #zope3-dev00:32
*** natea|sanfran has quit IRC00:44
*** natea has joined #zope3-dev00:48
*** rockyburt has quit IRC01:05
*** natea_ has joined #zope3-dev01:22
*** natea has quit IRC01:26
*** rockyburt has joined #zope3-dev01:30
*** natea_ has quit IRC01:37
*** natea has joined #zope3-dev01:44
*** SiggyF has quit IRC02:50
*** natea has quit IRC03:01
*** cilkay has quit IRC03:11
*** RaFromBRC has quit IRC03:27
*** kamalgill has quit IRC04:03
*** mcdonc has joined #zope3-dev04:19
*** sm has quit IRC04:34
*** sm has joined #zope3-dev04:37
*** gnibbler has quit IRC04:45
*** gnibbler has joined #zope3-dev04:46
*** mcdonc has quit IRC04:54
*** niemeyer has quit IRC05:39
*** stainsby has quit IRC05:44
*** whit has quit IRC06:08
*** TrevorP has joined #zope3-dev06:09
*** yota has joined #zope3-dev06:20
*** stub has joined #zope3-dev06:24
*** rockyburt has quit IRC07:19
*** dobee has joined #zope3-dev07:35
*** dobee has quit IRC07:48
*** zopePloneConsult has joined #zope3-dev07:50
*** philiKON has quit IRC07:54
*** eins has joined #zope3-dev08:04
*** natea has joined #zope3-dev08:05
*** dobee has joined #zope3-dev08:11
*** sashav has joined #zope3-dev08:36
*** sm has quit IRC08:52
*** sashav has quit IRC08:55
*** Theuni has quit IRC08:56
*** Theuni has joined #zope3-dev08:57
*** hdima has joined #zope3-dev09:13
*** hdima has quit IRC09:36
*** natea has quit IRC10:05
*** sashav has joined #zope3-dev10:21
*** hdima has joined #zope3-dev10:21
*** BjornT has quit IRC10:25
*** BjornT has joined #zope3-dev10:27
*** BjornT has quit IRC10:32
*** BjornT has joined #zope3-dev10:36
*** ignas has joined #zope3-dev10:44
*** srichter has joined #zope3-dev10:47
*** ChanServ sets mode: +o srichter10:49
dobeej1m: is it ok for you if i add zcml slugs for registering the ICollator adapter to zope.ucol,  additionally i will fix the adapter which passes the locale id which is a unicode to the Collator but the Collator wants a string11:18
*** SiggyF has joined #zope3-dev11:26
*** Aiste has quit IRC11:28
*** faassen has joined #zope3-dev11:35
*** tiredbones has quit IRC11:44
*** tiredbones has joined #zope3-dev11:45
*** alga has joined #zope3-dev11:50
*** b_52Centos__ has joined #zope3-dev12:03
*** b_52Centos has quit IRC12:17
*** b_52Centos__ is now known as b_52Centos12:18
*** mkerrin has joined #zope3-dev12:26
*** Aiste has joined #zope3-dev12:35
*** alga has quit IRC12:42
*** rockyburt has joined #zope3-dev12:56
*** mgedmin has joined #zope3-dev12:57
*** alga has joined #zope3-dev13:02
*** ignas has quit IRC13:18
*** ignas has joined #zope3-dev13:18
*** philiKON has joined #zope3-dev13:21
*** J1m_ has joined #zope3-dev13:24
*** zopePloneConsult has left #zope3-dev13:46
*** philiKON has quit IRC13:51
*** rockyburt has quit IRC13:59
*** regebro has joined #zope3-dev14:04
*** zopePloneConsult has joined #zope3-dev14:04
*** rockyburt has joined #zope3-dev14:13
*** romanofski has joined #zope3-dev14:15
*** dunny has quit IRC14:23
*** jinty has joined #zope3-dev14:29
*** J1m_ has quit IRC14:36
*** romanofski has quit IRC14:47
*** b_52Centos is now known as b_52Centos_miam15:09
*** mgedmin has quit IRC15:17
*** b_52Centos_miam is now known as b_52Centos15:35
*** alecm has joined #zope3-dev15:49
*** mkerrin has quit IRC15:51
*** philiKON has joined #zope3-dev15:53
*** niemeyer has joined #zope3-dev15:58
*** benji has joined #zope3-dev16:29
*** natea has joined #zope3-dev16:33
*** sashav has quit IRC16:36
*** philiKON has quit IRC16:44
*** eins has quit IRC16:51
*** philiKON has joined #zope3-dev16:51
*** alecm has quit IRC16:51
*** zbir has joined #zope3-dev16:55
*** roym has joined #zope3-dev16:55
roymThought I had a good handle on adapters and registration, but16:57
roymam baffled by why the first form succeeds, and not the second.16:57
roymHow would I debug this further?16:57
roym(Pdb) zapi.getAdapter(pdf, IPDFObject)16:57
roym  *** ComponentLookupError:16:57
roym  (<general.PDFObject object at 0x408b93ac>, <InterfaceClass16:57
roym  interfaces.IPDFObject>, u'')16:57
roym(Pdb) IPDFObject(pdf)16:57
roym  <general.PDFObject object at 0x408b93ac>16:57
roymsorry - I meant the first fails and the second succeeds.16:58
philiKONroym, zapi.getAdapter((pdf,), IPDFObject)17:02
roymah! thanks.17:03
*** alecm has joined #zope3-dev17:04
roymhmm, that didn't work..17:05
*** alecm is now known as alecm|tower17:05
roymsame error: (Pdb) zapi.getAdapter((pdf,), IPDFObject)17:06
roym  *** ComponentLookupError: ((<general.PDFObject object at17:06
roym  0x408b93ac>,), <InterfaceClass interfaces.IPDFObject>, u'')17:06
*** sm has joined #zope3-dev17:06
*** mgedmin has joined #zope3-dev17:08
roym(<InterfaceClass interfaces.IPDFObject>, <InterfaceClass persistent.interfaces.IPersistent>)17:08
ignasroym: duh, IPDFObject is not adapting anything17:12
ignasit is plainly returning the object i think17:12
ignasthere is not such adapter registered, probably17:13
ignasor i am talking nonsense again ;)17:13
ignasgetAdapter is a different thing from IFoo(object)17:14
* mgedmin reads IRC logs17:14
mgedminroym: there are two different adapter mechanisms17:14
roymIsn't IPDFObject(pdf) supposed to be syntactic sugar for getAdapter?17:15
ignasroym: nope, it is more like IPDFObject(pdf) checks whether pdf already implements IPDF, if not looks for __conform__ and only then looks for adapters17:16
mgedminthere was a PEP 246 about including adapters into core Python17:16
mgedminit was, apparently, rejected17:16
mgedminbut Zope 3 wanted to support that PEP and introduced the shorthand notation of IFoo(obj)17:17
mgedminthat also checks for __conform__17:17
mgedminand then falls back to getAdapter17:17
mgedminas a result IFoo(obj) is a more powerful adaptation mechanism17:17
mgedminbut it doesn't support multiadapters or subscription adapters17:17
roymguys, thanks for the clarification.17:18
*** Aiste has quit IRC17:23
mgedminit was very surprising to me once17:29
mgedminbut Jim said that's how it was supposed to be17:30
*** natea has quit IRC17:37
SteveAmgedmin: we'd make IFoo(...) do multi-adaption if there was a clean API for it17:41
SteveAbut we also need to support default values17:41
*** zbir has quit IRC17:41
mgedminIFoo((x, y, z), barf)17:43
*** zopePloneConsult has left #zope3-dev17:43
mgedminIFoo((x, y, z), name='gargle', default=barf)17:43
SteveAyes, but then say goodbye to adapting tuples, unless you already know they're tuples17:46
SteveA  IFoo(x)17:46
SteveAif x is a tuple, you can't adapt it how you expect to17:47
mgedminIFoo((x, ))?17:53
mgedminit's about the same as the % operator on strings17:53
mgedminyou cannot reliably do "foo is %s" % foo17:53
mgedminif foo could possibly be a tuple17:53
*** hdima has quit IRC18:05
*** stub has quit IRC18:06
*** s1 has joined #zope3-dev18:09
*** sm has quit IRC18:09
*** s1 is now known as sm18:10
*** alga has quit IRC18:17
*** efrerich has joined #zope3-dev18:32
regebroHuh. Why is IBrowserPublisher sometimes called as a single adapter and sometimes as a multi-adapter?18:32
regebroI guess this in one of the traversal refactorings j1m was talking about. :)18:32
*** zbir has joined #zope3-dev18:46
*** andres has quit IRC19:12
*** dobee has quit IRC19:13
*** natea has joined #zope3-dev19:19
*** alga has joined #zope3-dev19:24
*** srichter has quit IRC19:44
*** faassen has quit IRC19:57
*** mkerrin has joined #zope3-dev19:58
*** RaFromBRC has joined #zope3-dev20:01
*** natea has quit IRC20:21
*** alecm|tower has quit IRC20:29
regebroHey, mkerrin! Howsit hanging? :)20:42
*** jinty has quit IRC20:54
j1mI have a problem and I'd love to get some other folks optinions on it.20:56
j1mI'm testing my branch against an existing application.20:56
*** mkerrin has quit IRC20:56
j1mI have found lots of missing backward-compatibility that I've been dealing with.20:57
j1mTwo things have been particularly vexing.20:57
j1m1. Event reprs changed. Lots of tests depend on event reprs.  For now, I'm gonna try and work around this20:57
j1mby making the reprs the same as they were beforem, even if this means making them lie about their modules.20:58
j1m2. We are now generating events that we didn't generate previously.20:59
j1mI think both of these would be helped by better testing support in the future.20:59
j1mI'm at a loss to decide what do do for issue 2 now though.20:59
SteveAwhen you're testing events, you're generally only interested in a particular category of events21:01
SteveAand if an application raises other events, well that's fine, so long as they are outside the category you're interested in21:01
SteveAso, a test that checks to see all events raised for an operation is a fragile test21:02
j1mYes. We have lots of those.21:02
SteveAthere should be a standard piece of infrastructure (a categorized event channel...) to capture events from a category to help people writing tests21:02
SteveAin the interim, it hurts21:02
j1mI've encouraged that style I'm afraid.21:02
SteveAsure, all my event tests are like that too21:03
SteveAit ought to be fixable in one place per test21:03
j1mDo you think we should let these tests fail then?21:04
SteveAby making the test fixture event gatherer subscribe to a channel rather than all events21:04
SteveAi'm very -1 on failing tests on the trunk21:04
SteveAwant help on a field day to fix them up?21:04
j1mI wouldn't fail trunk tests, but I'd likely cause 3rd-party tests to fail.21:04
j1mAll tests are passing on my branch.21:05
SteveAi don't think that's so bad21:05
SteveAthat's an inevitable part of improving this kind of thing21:05
SteveAi think the improvement is worth it21:05
j1mIn this case, the new events are dou to the fact that registration events are generated by the global component registry as well as the local ones.21:07
j1mA hack would be to arrange that we don't get the events if you go through the convenience functions, component.provideAdapter, ... etc.21:08
j1mThese might be deprecated in the future anyway.21:08
j1mditto for the similat ztapi functions.21:09
*** srichter has joined #zope3-dev21:11
*** ChanServ sets mode: +o srichter21:12
*** regebro has quit IRC21:12
philiKONj1m, i think it's ok making people update their tests. the option you suggest would be quite hairy....21:18
j1mWell, I just tried it.  It was simple to implement and seems to work. :)21:18
j1mI'm inclined to try hard not to break tests.21:19
j1mHowever, we need to come up with a way to make event tests less brittle.21:19
j1mBut we can do this in the next release cycle.21:19
philiKONyes. even tfilterting is so easy, after all... it's usually just laziness21:19
j1mI'm feeling a lot of urgwncy to get this branch merged.21:19
philiKONyes, especially because we need its being merged so that zope 2 and five can follow21:20
philiKONby the way, how do you want to communicate that it is deprecated that the convenience functions won't throw events?21:20
j1mI'm afraid we're going t have to slip the freez date again.21:20
j1mI'll have to think about it.21:21
philiKONdo you have an estimate on when your branch might be mergable21:21
j1mI think we may want to encourage a style that doesn't use the convenience functions.21:21
j1mNot sure.  Maybe today.21:21
j1mBut that would require things going a lot better the rest of the day than they've gone the last 2 days. :)21:22
philiKONor we might provide different convenience functions21:22
philiKONprovide -> register perhaps21:22
philiKONthese might ahve different semantics21:22
philiKONthese being the new functions21:22
*** natea has joined #zope3-dev21:23
j1manyway, I'm going with te hack for now.21:24
philiKONok :)21:27
*** tarek has joined #zope3-dev21:37
*** dobee has joined #zope3-dev21:39
*** MJ has joined #zope3-dev21:40
*** MJ has quit IRC21:47
*** alecm|tower has joined #zope3-dev21:50
*** genconc has joined #zope3-dev21:58
*** natea has quit IRC22:01
*** alecm|tower is now known as alecm22:04
*** ignas has quit IRC22:11
*** efrerich_ has joined #zope3-dev22:17
*** mgedmin has quit IRC22:18
*** alecm has quit IRC22:22
*** alecm has joined #zope3-dev22:23
*** Theuni has quit IRC22:32
*** efrerich has quit IRC22:35
*** alga has quit IRC22:38
*** tarek has quit IRC22:43
*** sm has quit IRC22:47
*** MJ has joined #zope3-dev22:50
*** dunny has joined #zope3-dev22:51
*** srichter has quit IRC22:51
*** efrerich_ is now known as efrerich22:52
*** srichter has joined #zope3-dev22:52
*** ChanServ sets mode: +o srichter22:55
*** alecm has quit IRC22:55
*** MJ has quit IRC23:02
*** whit has joined #zope3-dev23:10
*** whit has quit IRC23:17
*** Aiste has joined #zope3-dev23:27
*** tav has joined #zope3-dev23:32
*** sashav has joined #zope3-dev23:35
*** tarek has joined #zope3-dev23:37
*** jinty has joined #zope3-dev23:52
*** zbir` has joined #zope3-dev23:54

Generated by 2.15.1 by Marius Gedminas - find it at!