IRC log of #zope3-dev for Monday, 2007-01-08

WebMavenccomb: that won't work.00:00
WebMavenBut there is a DirectoryStorage thta more-or-less does what you would expect it to.00:01
ccombok thanks00:02
ccombis there any benchmarks of zodb for different tasks ?00:02
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WebMaventhe only benchmarks that matter are the ones of your application.00:04
WebMavenI can give you some rules of thumb.00:05
WebMavenZODB FileStorage is read-optimized. write-heavy applications have lower performance.00:05
ccombAnd I'm wondering what would be the results of putting the Data.fs on a SSD (flash drive)00:06
ccombit would be much better for seek time00:06
WebMavenoTOH, a non-undoable storage like DirectoryStorage eliminates the write penalty.00:06
ccombah interesting00:06
WebMavenWell, flash wears out.00:06
WebMaventhe ZODB is undoable because it appends a new copy of an object to the end of the file.00:07
WebMavenso you can get back to old revisions.00:07
WebMavenbut this means that the Data.fs grows with every edit.00:08
WebMavenyou can purge the Data.fs of older copies, which shrinks it again, but this happens by writing out a new Data.fs and throwing away the old ones.00:09
WebMavenThis would all be very hard on Flash, and wear it out.00:09
WebMavenSo, if you want to use Flash, use a non-undoable storage, like DirectoryStorage.00:10
WebMavenunless, of course, in your application you expect data to usually be write once anyway.00:12
WebMavenDoes that make sense?00:13
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zenwrylydoes anyone know why Zope 2.10 seems to include zodbcode but not
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ccombI have a recurring question about the ++apidoc++00:44
ccombIn Philipp's book, there is an example of Choice field in a schema00:44
ccombweekday = Choice(title=u'weekday',  values=[u'monday', u'tuesday', ....]00:45
ccombHow can I guess that the "values" parameter exist ?00:45
ccombWhere is it documented ?00:46
ccombThe apidoc does not document __init__ constructors ?00:46
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WebMaveneins: I saw in the ML that you had some ZAlchemy demo code. Is that available somewhere?08:43
einsWebMaven I don't think it is. I can put it once again somewhere;)08:45
WebMavenit was this:
WebMavenif you have any other examples, they would be appreciated.08:47
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einsWebMaven try
einsthis is  not a clean code though08:51
einsand it does not work out of the box, modify it for yourself;)08:52
WebMavenyou mean, don't ask for your help?08:52
WebMavenzagy: I see you checked in at least one ZAlchemy fix. Do you have any demo or example code lying around I can look at?08:54
WebMaveneins: AYT?08:58
WebMavenzagy: AYT?08:59
einsWebMaven I was trying to set it up so that it would support the "autoload" feature of sqlalchemy and several connections for single object and08:59
eins          didn't succeed08:59
einsso I haven't used it any more08:59
WebMavenDo you use anything else?09:00
einsit didn't seem to me very useful at that time09:00
einswe have our own o-r mapper09:00
WebMavenis it released?09:01
einsWebMaven try sqlos09:01
einsno it is not released09:01
einsand try zalchemy also:) maybe it fit you:)09:02
WebMavenI tried SQLOS, but it got all pathological on my insisting on naming conventions even when I overrided them.09:02
WebMavenZAlchemy is looking like a good option. I am just looking for more ZAlchemy demo code.09:02
zagyWebMaven: hi09:04
zagyWebMaven: we used zalchemy for an internal project09:04
zagyWebMaven: but have a look at the doctests, they helped me a bit09:04
WebMaventhey were *some* help, but if you have any simple demo code you can share (even if not perfect) I would appreciate it.09:06
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WebMavenzagy: or, if you know anyone else who has used ZAlchemy and might have similar examples.09:07
zagyhave you looked at the sqlalchemy tutorial?09:08
einsWebMaven try looking at example I gave you, you can't think of anything more simple09:08
WebMavenOK, thanks.09:08
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WebMaveneins: yes, this looks good. Along with some other examples I found, I think I'll be able to make a good working demo package for people to learn from.09:13
WebMavenOK, I need to take a break. Thanks folks!09:15
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SteveATheuni: ping14:32
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SteveAJ1m: ping14:32
SteveAhi Jim14:32
SteveAjim, meeting matthew revell and james henstridge14:33
SteveAand vice versa14:33
matthewrevellJ1m: hello :)14:33
SteveAjames is the launchpad developer who will be modifying the collector and doing the imports of bugs etc.14:33
J1mah, cool14:33
SteveAmatthew is the launchpad community communications person14:34
SteveAso, he leads documentation efforts and arrangements with the user community of launchpad14:34
SteveAthe three of us are currently in a skype conf call, talking about how to go about doing the bugs import for zope314:34
SteveAI'd like james to get hold of the code that is used for the collector, and if possible, its Data.fs14:35
SteveAif that's not possible, it's okay, and he can work from just the code14:35
SteveAdo you know what version of the collector + zope is used?14:35
J1mhee hee14:35
J1mI can get you the code.14:35
SteveAah, one of *those* questions ;-)14:36
J1mBetter yet, I suspect, I can get you an xml export (and a binary export) of the collector.14:36
J1mThere's a pretty good chance you can get what you want from the xml export.14:36
J1mWithout even thinking very hard. :)14:36
SteveAoh... so it wouldn't be an xml pickle export?14:36
J1mYes, it would be.14:37
J1mxml pickle exports can be quite usable.14:37
jameshJ1m: that might work pretty well.  Will that have user account data for people who've used the collector?14:37
J1mIn our experience.14:37
SteveAsounds challenging but do-able14:37
J1mIt isn't as challenging as you might think.14:37
jameshfor an import, I need an email address at a minimum, and preferably a display name14:37
J1msince most Python data structures are dicts.14:37
SteveAwhen we do exports/imports, we usually carefully link up the owners of comments and subscribers and all that kind of thing14:38
SteveAto make for a good transition14:38
J1mfair enough14:38
SteveAit's possible to do it without that14:38
J1mI expect that the export will have the z.o user name.14:38
SteveAbut it means more work getting started in launchpad afterwards, of course14:38
J1mI could also generate some sort of file with user names and email addresses.14:38
jameshsure.  I can do an import that loses comment attribution, but it'd be nice to avoid that14:39
J1mI assume we have that as well.14:39
SteveAsounds good, jim14:39
J1mOne of the first tasks will be to see what the xml export looks like.14:39
J1mBTW, as far as data manipulation, a common second task is to write a little bit of xslt to get the pickle dump into a more convenient form, extracting the interesting bits, etc.14:40
J1mIf that doesn't work (easily) than the backup plan is for someone like me to write a script that reads the collector data and dumps it.14:41
J1mI suspect though that looking at the xml dump will be easier.14:41
SteveAthere's a standard xml format we use for important14:41
SteveAum, for imports14:42
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J1mI gotta go to f12g.14:42
SteveAJ1m: part of my original offer to the zope3 community is writing such scripts, btw14:42
jameshJ1m: we've got an XML format we've developed plus importer code for Launchpad14:43
J1mWhy dont' you start an email thread so I have everyone's addresses.14:43
SteveAso, if there are privacy implications then sure, you do it14:43
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SteveAok, will do14:43
SteveAthanks for the chat14:43
jameshJ1m: so the goal here is to munge the collector data into the format the importer expects14:43
J1mThanks for helping out with this!14:43
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J1mand thankd for Launchpad!14:43
J1mjamesh, right14:43
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jameshit'd be a bonus if the scripts for converting the collector data are usable by other zope collector users that want to migrate14:43
* SteveA sends email14:46
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TheuniSteveA: pong16:09
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ignashow does one make strings in zcml translatable ? I have viewlet declarations with a title attribute in them, and i want i18n extraction code to spot them ...17:16
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SteveATheuni: hi17:52
matthewrevellTheuni: Hi Christian, you emailed me in reply to my posting on the zope3-dev list17:55
SteveATheuni: I just pasted matthewrevell the chat we just had17:56
Theunimatthewrevell: yup.17:56
matthewrevellTheuni: I'm just about to write you an email, following the conversation I had with SteveA and James Henstridge earlier17:57
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oferphiliKON: here?23:33
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oferis this the last updated file?23:43
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