IRC log of #zope3-dev for Thursday, 2007-07-26

javimansillalater, I'll have to put on my configure.zcml that state field should use this widget00:01
philiKONmore like in your formlib form00:01
javimansillaactually? ummm, the book suggest the zcml... but I see that you are improving you material :-)00:02
philiKONas i said, 1st ed sucks :)00:02
philiKON2nd edition describes formlib00:02
philiKONwhich is THE way to do forms nowadays00:02
javimansilladamned :-)00:03
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javimansillahere the book buyer says that he asked the 2nd edition to amazon. Dunno why they send us the 1st00:06
wiggyI had a hard time figuring out which edition amazon was offering me00:06
wiggyended up just ordering it at the local bookshop00:06
javimansillagood decision00:07
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wiggygah, buildout assertion error strikes again00:12
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philiKONwiggy: it's really easy, simply go to my website and follow the amazon links00:39
philiKONalso, amazon tends to say "2nd edition" :)00:39
philiKONnot that i want to keep you from going to your bookstore00:39
wiggythat's now :)00:39
__selfhey philipp, your book rules.. but you already knew that00:40
__self:O :)00:40
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__selfone minor gripe though...00:41
__selfyour only pictures are of browser screenshots.. I'd like to see figures with boxes/circles/arrows/etc showing components, adapters and what not00:43
philiKONthey'll come, though not that soon00:43
philiKONdrawing graphs with circles and arrows is harder than you think00:43
__selfi know :(00:43
philiKONand frankly, i don't think that way00:43
wiggythere are excellent tools to do that for you00:44
philiKONso i don't know how to draw them well so that others understand it00:44
philiKONfuck the tools00:44
philiKONi don't know what a circle should be00:44
philiKONit's not the tools that i'm worried about00:44
__selftext-only is quite heavy reading for a beginner :)00:44
philiKONit's the actual meaning00:44
__selfyeah, i see the complications of doing figures00:44
philiKONbut text is much more expressive00:45
philiKONanyway, i have some figures that will be included in some future edition00:45
philiKONonce they're polished00:45
philiKONbut generally i'm of the opinion that a few lines of code are better than a poor graph00:46
__selfi agree, but I also think not having any graph at _all_ makes it slightly more difficult00:47
__selfbut people think differently, some are visualizers like me..00:47
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philiKONthen draw a picture :)00:48
__selfyep, that's what I do :)00:48
philiKONgreat. what's the problem then?00:48
__selfit'd be good to confirm that I've actually understood it properly00:49
__selfafter all, my sketches are the interpretation of the text00:49
philiKONright. but let's say you send them to me for verifications00:49
philiKONi'd have to interpret your graphs00:49
philiKONhow would i do that?00:50
philiKONi don't know how your twisted mind works :)00:50
__selfbut it's still a minor gripe.. don't take it too seriosly00:51
__selfthe book is very solid00:51
__self2nd ed. that is :P00:52
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philiKONi take every suggeston seriously00:52
philiKON(right until i discover they're completely stupid ;))00:52
philiKON(though this one isn't *completely* stupid ;))00:53
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philiKONargh, down again01:09
philiKONhmm, no just slow :(01:09
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dabuhow do you get Zope3 to find your modules in Windows?03:16
dabutrying to do the "Zope3 in 30 minutes" tutorial, but in Windows and it wont find the module you creat03:16
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dabuok you need a file04:11
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bigkevmcddabu: on the upside, that's not just on windows04:34
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* mgedmin registers
* baijum wonder how mgedmin linked existing bugs16:25
* baijum found "Also affects:" link (/+choose-affected-product), cool !16:28
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mgedminfor some bugs you can click on the triangle next to zope3 and change the project to zope.testing16:29
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mgedminI can replace <adapter for=".IFoo" factory=".getFoo"> with <adapter factory=".getFoo"> if I use @adapts(IFoo) in front of def getFoo(...):18:31
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mgedminwhat's the directive for <subscriber for=".IFoo" handler=".handleFoo"> ?18:32
mgedminis it @adapter as well, or is there a @subscriber?18:32
srichtermgedmin: it is @adapts as well18:32
srichtermgedmin: because the only difference between a regular and subscription adapter is in the registry18:33
srichterbut not in the signature18:33
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dennis_hi, can anyone recommend a package which allows scheduling events based on time? (like cron more or less)21:34
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mgedminwhat's happening to today?21:59
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TresEquisBTW, the egg story for Zope3 is pretty horribly broken22:38
TresEquis the dependencies are complete crap22:38
TresEquis relying on a buildout to deliver a custom set of eggs is *not* the answer22:38
TresEquisfor instance, try doing 'easy_install zope.publisher' -- it ends up in complete crapville22:38
mgedminmy understanding of the situation is "work in progress"22:38 contains too much stuff not yet suitable for use22:39
TresEquisand nobody is minding the store22:39
TresEquiswe need a "no dev packages allowed" place22:39
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TresEquisbecause people are pushing dev packages out to that location without considering ramifications22:40
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mgedminlike linux distros have (stable/unstable)22:41
TresEquisyes, perhaps22:42
TresEquisI'm in the process of experimenting with such a directory22:44
TresEquisthat seems to allow the install to go through22:47
TresEquisthe dependencies are still too broad22:47
TresEquisbut at least they don't conflict22:47
TresEquisspoke too soon22:48
TresEquissomebody wants a ''22:48
TresEquisand there is no released version22:48
TresEquisthis is a *massive* quality assurance problem22:48
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TresEquisphiliKON: howdy22:50
* TresEquis is bitching about state of Zope3 egg story22:50
TresEquisdev eggs should be shot22:50
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TresEquis has hard links of all non-dev eggs/dists now22:56
TresEquisbut nothing will keep that up to date, dammit22:57
TresEquisI just pushed a 3.4.0b1 version of up, too22:57
TresEquisso that I can install zope.publisher ;(22:57
TresEquisI'm working on eggifying zope.bobo22:58
TresEquisits direct dependencies are minimal: 'zope.interface',22:59
TresEquis                      'zope.publisher',22:59
TresEquis                      'zope.event',22:59
TresEquis                      'zope.component',22:59
TresEquis                      '',22:59
TresEquis                      'setuptools',22:59
TresEquisbut that expands to 60+ packages22:59
TresEquisincluding a bunch of* thingies22:59
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J1mTresEquis, I sympathize.23:07
J1mMaybe we need to schedule an egg day.23:08
J1mTresEquis, why are you messing with zope.bobo?23:08
TresEquisI've been avoiding this hairball for a bit, but it is essentially the "brand risk" I talked about in Potsdam23:08
J1mYes, I agree.23:08
TresEquishmm, I have a small app which could use an alternative root object23:09
TresEquisrather than ZODB23:09
TresEquisI figured that zope.bobo was the place to start23:09
J1mI guess you're trying to use the bobo publication.23:09
J1mI never got far with that.23:09
TresEquisI'd really like to have a configuration-defined top-level mapping23:10
J1mBasically, you just need al alternative publication component.23:10
J1mThat's pretty straightforward, once you know it is an option.23:10
TresEquisone key might be ZODB based, another RDBMS based, another static filesystem23:10
TresEquisanother might do module publishing23:11
TresEquiscould be named utilitiies registered for IApplicatoinRoot, or something23:11
J1mI'm sure you've read IPublication (or whatever it's called) and know how to proceed.23:11
J1mThat might be an option.23:11
J1mMost people end up wanting something more sophisticated, usually involving regexs against URLs.23:12
TresEquisthat would be possible, but I firmly believe in Peters' Law of Regexes23:12
TresEquisand I *like* object graphs ;)23:13
J1mme too23:13
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TresEquissomebody who wants the regex thingy could register a default utility23:13
J1manyway, I hope the bobo experiment helps show you how without you needing to actually reuse it.23:13
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TresEquiswhy not reuse it?23:13
J1mI wish we hadn't spent time breaking up
TresEquisBTW, I've just added eggification23:14
J1mBecause it is just a start.23:14
TresEquiswe have dependcies pointing into  it23:14
J1ma one weekend experiment.23:14
TresEquisbut that is a hairball23:14
J1mwhy do we have dependencies pointing into it?23:14
TresEquiszope.pagetemplate depends on, for instance23:14
J1myeah, what does that have to do w zope.bobo.23:15
TresEquiszope.bobo wants zope.publication23:15
TresEquiswhich pulls in a *lot* of stuff23:15
TresEquisI just added and README to the zope.bobo trunk23:16
J1mso you aren't saying that zope.bobo is a dependency of other things.23:16
* J1m wished TresEquis would stop. :)23:16
TresEquisright, it depends directly on a little bit23:16
TresEquisbut transitively on a mess23:16
TresEquisthat would be true for my app which wanted to do alternative publication, though23:16
J1manyway, I agree on your opinion about the hairball.23:16
J1mI acknowledge the problem. :)23:17
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TresEquisdid you see that I had made a 'released' subdir of the distribution directory?23:17
J1mI saw you mention it above.23:17
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projekt01I think we should do a egg week not just a egg day ;-)23:23
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J1mTresEquis, in many respects, we still have a monolith.23:26
J1mJust moving to eggs didn't fix that, although it managed to knock off a few chips.23:27
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J1mI think we can make this better, but I'ts going to require making some backward incompatible changes at the packaging level (not the application level).23:28
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projekt01J1m, we should do that.23:32
J1myes, we should.23:32
projekt01J1m, I guess yo are the only one which can do that, without getting involved in endless discussion ;-)23:33
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J1mThat's a good way to put it.23:42
J1mBut I can't do it myself.23:42
J1mBut I think the next steps may want to be done with a lot more care than the previous set.23:42
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TresEquisI seem to be missing some testing hair23:48
TresEquisand of course, zope.bobo isn't up-to-date with Zope 3.423:48
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J1mdon't use zope.bobo. :)23:50
* J1m needs to move it to some sort of grave yard23:51
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fsufitchsrichter, ayt?23:59

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