IRC log of #zope3-dev for Monday, 2007-08-27

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romanofskimoin :)09:43
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agroszerprojet01_: ayt?12:45
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arnarl_Do I need to run removeSecurityProxy if I wish to store a reference to another persistent object? Ie will ZODB correctly persist a security proxy?14:45
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agroszerarnarl_: ZODB won't persist a proxied object14:50
arnarl_agroszer: thnx14:50
arnarl_how do I re-add a security-proxy for objects I return in a method?14:51
agroszerthe easyest way is when you return it from a proxied objects method14:53
agroszersomething like14:53
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projekt01agroszer, Hi14:55
arnarl_hmm, that probably won't work for what I need. Can I find examples of the wrapping in the containment code?14:55
agroszerhi projekt0114:55
projekt01Saw your mail14:55
agroszerprojekt01: "hat sich erledigt", David just responded14:56
agroszerarnarl_: I don't know (yet) a better way14:57
projekt01cool, hope to see you over there14:58
agroszerlet's cross the fingers14:58
arnarl_agroszer: k, thnx :-)14:59
projekt01agroszer, cross, cross15:00
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arnarl_will an identity-test work across security-proxies if I have two different security-proxy-objects for the same persistent object?15:54
arnarl_>>> objecta is object15:54
arnarl_>>> objecta is objectb15:54
mgedminarnarl_: most likely not15:55
mgedminIIRC has a helper function for comparing the identity of a proxied object15:55
mgedminah, no, it only has a
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CrippsFXmorning fellas.16:58
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ignasso apparently Zope3.4 is not going to be available in Ubuntu gutsy, does anyone have any ideas which Zope3 version should i target if i want my software to work in gutsy+1?17:36
timtedo you mean out of the box? if not, any python/zope version is installable in any (almost) version of any (almost) distribution17:38
ignasi mean out of the box17:38
ignasas in if i want my software to be installable as a debian package17:38
ignasi need Zope3 i depend on released as  a debian package too17:39
CrippsFXignas: well, won't 3.3 be available on gutsy then, if it's already available in edgy?17:44
ignasCrippsFX: yes, but schooltool depends on 3.417:44
CrippsFXignas: ahhh ... schooltool.17:45
ignasso i don't want to jump to the next version too early again17:45
ignasand am wondering whether anyone knows what are the plans for gutsy+117:45
CrippsFXI've no idea ... I'm not really involved in the packaging side of things.17:45
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CrippsFXnow here I've got a *crazy* question ... how would I go about overriding the principals.zcml configuration locally?17:47
ignaswhat do you mean by locally?17:47
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CrippsFXignas: well, I want to do it programatically, so that when somebody downloads my svn code and plops it into their zope instance, they'll only have to create a package-configure file (at the most)17:48
CrippsFXand by locally, I mean I want my app to override the instance's principals.zcml17:48
ignasCrippsFX: emm, and then what?17:49
ignasso you want to override locally or globally?17:49
ignaslocally means - only valid when looking at your application object17:49
CrippsFXignas: locally.17:49
ignasglobally - your new users/principals are valid when looking at the zmi views for all other applications/objects17:50
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ignasso you need an object added event subsciber that would make your application a site17:50
ignasand add all the required local authentication utilities to it17:50
CrippsFXignas: my app already has the site stuff ... I sort of figured I would use the default authentication machinery ... the only thing I want to change about it is the principals.17:51
ignasyou see - it's the authentication utility that decides what is and what is not a principal17:52
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CrippsFXignas ... yeah ... what's going on though, is that I have created an application level principals.zcml, but the only issue it's having is that things like <AuthenticatedUser .../> are already defined by the instance's principals.zcml17:53
ignasyou can't override them locally17:54
ignasthese are principals used by the global authentication utility17:54
ignasso if you will override them or add more of them17:54
ignasthey will work application wide17:55
CrippsFXI see.17:55
ignasit's all in the code17:55
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ignaslook at PrincipalRegistry17:55
ignasi think it's the one used by default17:55
philiKON_yes, that's the global IAuthentication utility17:55
CrippsFXthere is a default local authentication utility that uses pretty much the same machinery as the global authentication utility, correct?17:56
ignasgetPrincipals is the method that list all the principals17:56
philiKON_CrippsFX: not really17:56
CrippsFXphiliKON_: oh, damn.17:56
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philiKON_the glboal one is pretty simple17:56
philiKON_it's filled thru zcml17:56
philiKON_(e.g. in principals.zcml)17:56
philiKON_and it only handles basicauth17:56
philiKON_the local one is PAU17:56
philiKON_RTFB :)17:56
CrippsFXhahaha. yeah, have been :P17:56
CrippsFXthat's chapter 22 :P17:57
philiKON_then read it again :). i didn't write it just so i can quote it again in irc17:57
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CrippsFXphiliKON_: I'll read through the chapter another couple of times. If I have another question about how the machinery works I'll come back and ask again ;)17:58
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ignasno, wrong answer!18:00
ignasyou will go and read the code ;)18:00
CrippsFX"luke, read the source!"18:00
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mgedminI think the correct quotation is "Use the Source, Luke"18:01
CrippsFXmgedmin: it's been years since I've watched the movie, I can't be expected to remember everything ;)18:02
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CrippsFXphiliKON_: the only realy problem I have with the way your book approaches the PAU and principal management is that the PAU has to be added through the Site manager AddMenu ... I'm looking for a way to do this all programatically.18:18
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philiKON_folder['mypau'] = PluggableAuthenticationUtility()18:18
philiKON_i believe, though, that my book does explain how to set up a PAU programmatically18:19
CrippsFXphiliKON_: it goes through the addmenu for the PAU in the beginning of the chapter, and then goes through all the steps required to effectively use the PAU ... the steps to use it are done programatically, but the addition of the utility is not.18:20
CrippsFXfolder['mypau']=PluggableAuthenticationUtility() adds the pau to the site where folder[] *is* the site (or potential site), correct?18:21
philiKON_then you also need to register it as a utility18:21
* mgedmin thinks there's a couple of parens missing in philiKON_'s last utterance18:22
CrippsFXphiliKON_: kk. Thanks.18:22
philiKON_look at how to set up a local utility18:22
philiKON_a few chapters earlier18:22
CrippsFXyeah, that's in the sites chapter.18:23
* CrippsFX is off again.18:23
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instantfoo"where "18:50
instantfoo                  folder[] *is* the site (or potential site), correct?18:50
instantfoohmm, shouldn't you add it to the folder's site manager?18:50
instantfooand not folder['pau']18:50
instantfooso.. folder.getSiteManager()['mypau'] = pau18:51
instantfoophiliKON_: :)18:52
philiKON_you can do that too18:52
philiKON_it doesnt' really matter where you place the pau18:52
philiKON_as long as you register it with the site manager as a utility18:52
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CrippsFXso for me it would probably be better to do it the way instantfoo prescribed since we're going to have menus based on the contents of folder[]19:00
CrippsFXand I can do that in the setSiteManager() method of my site, right after the manager is set.19:01
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naroI'd like to store uploaded image in annotation of the object. I want to use formlib. What field/widget should I use? I need to display file-upload widget, post-process uploaded data and store them in the annotation.19:44
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CrippsFXhm ... I'm having some interesting behaviour in trying to add the PAU ... the traceback is located here:   ... what happens is: site.getSiteManager().['mypau']=PluggableAuthentication();site.getSiteManager().registerUtility(site.getSiteManager()['mypau']); and I get a traceback, but when I check the siteManager, 'mypau' is present in the manager; I'd like to know if the behaviour of mypau will be affected by this19:54
CrippsFX, and/or how I can fix the error. I'm using PluggableAuthentication() from (there is no PluggableAuthenticationUtility())19:54
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philiKON_CrippsFX: registerUtility(pau, IAuthentication)19:57
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CrippsFXphiliKON_: ah. thanks.20:03
* CrippsFX is a dumbass20:03
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CrippsFXphiliKON_: in your book you cover using http basic-auth (which uses Session Credentials) ... I'm wondering about "Zope Realm Basic-Auth" ... does that behave like the Global Authentication Utility that a Zope instance uses by default?20:26
philiKON_your first sentence m akes no sense20:26
philiKON_yes otherwise20:27
CrippsFXsorry ... I was just stating that I wondering about an alternative to the authentication type you covereed in chapter 22 of your book.20:27
CrippsFX*covered even.20:28
CrippsFXokay. Thank you.20:28
philiKON_i have no idea what you're talking about20:28
philiKON_you're welcome :)20:28
CrippsFXthat's okay, you've answered my question anyways ;)20:28
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instantfoohehe :)20:30
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instantfooCrippsFX: what you get as default with Z3 is HTTP Basic auth, and in ch22 a session credential plug-in is explained20:34
CrippsFXinstantfoo: yep, got it :)20:34
instantfoobut there is also a cookie-credential which has a session credential plugin mixin :)20:36
philiKON_it just inherits from session credentials for convenience20:37
philiKON_it's not a mixin in that sense20:37
philiKON_the actual functionality is cookies20:37
philiKON_instead of sessions20:37
instantfoothis might be a bit confusing to readers :)20:37
CrippsFXI think Imma want to use the session-credential without the cookie-credential ... that way I don't have to worry about the security issues, and when the demo is over, I can just extend the plugin.20:37
CrippsFXyeah ... the authentication sections are a bit confusing for anybody who wants to do something different than cookie-based authentication ;)20:38
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philiKON_CrippsFX: if you write me an email outlining what confused you and what you think is missing from the section, i'll be happy to consider it in a future ed20:40
CrippsFXphiliKON_: awesome. When I figure out *precisely* what I'm doing, I'll send you that email.20:40
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spythonweee :)20:43
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CrippsFXphiliKON_: one example of a "confusing bit" (I guess), is: if I'm using sessions instead of cookies, will the login form (as specified on pg. 422 of the book) automagically use sessions, and will there be any other changes required in, say, example 22.3.1?20:48
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philiKON_yes and no20:49
philiKON_yes, the login form will automatically use sessions20:49
philiKON_that's because the login form is a separate component from the credentials plugin20:49
philiKON_the credentials plugin (whichever it is) will simply call the login form20:49
philiKON_and then get the data out of it20:49
philiKON_the login form doesn't care (and doesnt know) what the credentials method is20:50
philiKON_i think this should be clear20:50
CrippsFXI see. So, there should already be an existing "SessionCredentialsEditForm" out there?20:50
philiKON_i'll have to check the text again20:50
philiKON_sure, zope3 has an existing login form20:50
philiKON_but you can always supply your own one20:50
philiKON_as far as example 22.3.1 is concerned20:51
CrippsFXach so ... I see where I went wrong on that.20:51
philiKON_i thought i made it very clear that credential and authentircator plugins work separately20:51
philiKON_22.3.1 is an authenticator plugin20:51
philiKON_it doesn't care which credentials plugin was used20:51
CrippsFX22.3.1 just deals with the authentication, not the credentials.20:51
philiKON_this should be clear20:51
philiKON_that's what i meant20:51
CrippsFXyes ... got it now :)20:51
philiKON_anyway, please read the text again and see if that isn't clear20:52
philiKON_if it's not, please write that email :)20:52
philiKON_otherwise i will forget20:52
spythonphiliKON_: you get paid by the hour? :D20:52
CrippsFXwill do.20:52
philiKON_spython: normally i do. why?20:52
spythonfor teaching zope @irc ;)20:53
CrippsFXbecause today you're really getting extra time by answering my questions ;)20:53
philiKON_well, i told CrippsFX to RTFB several times now20:53
philiKON_but he won't listen :)20:53
CrippsFXyeah, I'm a real arsehole like that.20:53
spythoni got the book now20:53
spythonit rules20:53
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CrippsFXit does. My comprehension just isn't working well today since I haven't really eaten anything at all ....20:54
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CrippsFX... and it's still an hour before quitting time ... I think  I'll go grab more red bull.20:54
spythonyou work with zope?20:56
CrippsFXyep, I work with zope ... and I'm merely a university student ;)20:57
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CrippsFXspython: yeah, it's a pretty sweet job for me ... although I'm cutting down to 19 hrs/week when classes start again21:05
CrippsFX..and I have my own office, phone, and 2 computers @ work ;)21:05
CrippsFXbbl ... gotta help lug a shitload of monitors upstairs.21:11
Nederhoedgood luck21:12
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CrippsFXso to get site.getSiteManager['pau'] to use the Session Credentials plugin, I *should* do: site.getSiteManager()['mypau']['session'] =;  correct?21:31
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instantfooCrippsFX: yes, you should to that :)21:37
CrippsFXinstantfoo: and it should be registered via site.getSiteManager().registerUtility(session, ?);21:37
CrippsFX(session, ICredentialsPlugin) ?21:38
instantfooyeah, i think it was something named like that :)21:38
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CrippsFXI hope it's the right now ;)21:39
instantfoobtw,  what editor you use?21:39
CrippsFXinstantfoo: vim all the way :P21:40
instantfoogood, then you *need* to generate ctags for the zope source :)21:40
CrippsFXI've never really used ctags before.21:41
CrippsFXinstantfoo: do you know of a good how to to set them up for the zope source?21:41
instantfoohmm i could guide you :)21:43
CrippsFXinstantfoo: :)   ... I'll download ctags first, then I'll ask you what comes next :)21:44
instantfooit comes with vim21:44
CrippsFXinstantfoo: alright. Guide me then :)21:44
instantfoocd <zopedir>/lib21:45
instantfooctags -R python21:45
instantfoo..i think21:45
instantfooyou should have a "tags" file there with a bunch of stuff21:45
instantfooput that file somewhere in ~/.vim/21:46
instantfooyou might want to name it zope3.tags or something..21:47
instantfooCrippsFX: ping21:47
CrippsFXalright. had to create ~/.vim, but it's there now21:47
CrippsFXdo I have to add anything to my ~/.vimrc ?21:48
instantfoonow you should put "set tags=~/.vim/zope.tags" in vimrc..21:48
instantfoozope3.tags or whatever you named it21:48
instantfoohmm, this is only relevant for python so maybe this is better in vimrc:21:49
instantfooau FileType python set tags=~/.vim/tags/zope.tags21:49
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instantfoonow open up some python file21:49
instantfoopositionyour cursor on a class name or whatever.. and press <C-]>21:50
CrippsFXno tags found ... I'll have to double check the filename :P21:52
CrippsFXinstantfoo: E429: File "/home/acripps/.vim/python/zope/app/security/" does not exist21:54
instantfoowhat name was your cursor on?21:54
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CrippsFXI had double quotes around the location of the tags file, so I removed them. That error is what I get now.21:55
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instantfoowhat's your line in vimrc?21:56
instantfoopaste it as it is please :)21:56
CrippsFX au FileType python set tags=~/.vim/zope3.tags21:56
CrippsFXinstantfoo: the tags file uses relative links.21:56
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CrippsFXinstantfoo: so, from ~/.vim I ran "ctags -r /opt/Zope/lib/python" and then renamed that file to zope3.tags :)21:57
instantfooand it works now?21:57
CrippsFXinstantfoo: thanks :)21:57
CrippsFXyep, it works now.21:58
instantfoobtw..  <C-T> jumps back if you jumped to a file21:58
instantfoo<C-W>] opens up a tag match in a new window21:59
CrippsFXcool.Thanks. I'll have to find a ctags cheatsheet now ...21:59
instantfoog] shows a list of matches of the current position, good if there are several22:00
CrippsFXoop ... 4:30 ... hometime ... which is good ... because I need to eat and take a nap.22:00
instantfooalright …]22:00
CrippsFXthanks for the help. I'll see you guys in the morning.22:00
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benjioh no!  The zope3-dev PEP 8 naming infection has spread to Python 3000:
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benjiLuckily the Dictator straightened things out
philiKON_hum, christian heimes23:14
philiKON_haven't heard from him in ages23:14
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